Author Topic: Who will win the 2016 US Presidential election?  (Read 7348 times)

Offline Fool010

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Re: Who will win the 2016 US Presidential election?
« Reply #240 on: January 01, 2017, 08:13:32 am »

We are the system, and we are the rulers.
:laugh:

That's hilarious as you're constantly accusing me of being naive.

If I'm the dreamer, then you would be the realist, tell me then, what are the solutions? Because I see none.

I'm not the one who pulled a load of crock about a "state of low vibration".
 
There are no solutions for the time being, since we refuse to accept we -mankind as a whole- are the reason every social construct we come up with is by design destined to fail since everything wrong you'll find there has been put there by us. Suggesting there are some nefarious hidden powers conspiring to keep mankind down is merely a childish fantasy pulled out of thin air because admitting everything ugly in society comes from us and can be found in everyone is too unpleasant to accept. The system reflects what we are and is designed to express that, hence we are the system, we are the masters. But that's something we don't want to admit, the perspective of not being the extraordinary creatures we fancy ourselves to be is so horrific we come up with fantasies about hidden powers conspiring to keep us down.

The ones complaining about elites keeping them down would do the very same if they were given the power to do so , because it's not indignation they express but jealousy. It's not against oppression they're railing up, it's against being the oppressed. Hand over the stick and they'll gladly dish out the beating.

Human civilization has been around for only a few millennia, I suppose we're still experiencing growth pains. For the time being, there's no way out.  To use a common trope, we're not ready yet for a better world. You cannot improve society as a whole if you don't admit we have to improve individually in order to achieve that.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2017, 08:20:21 am by Fool010 »
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Offline Reape

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Re: Who will win the 2016 US Presidential election?
« Reply #241 on: January 01, 2017, 12:29:45 pm »
How about you even name the problem before you start discussing how to solve it or if it's even possible to solve. Ought to make the discussion easier.
Nordic cultural imperialist.

Offline Stridar

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Re: Who will win the 2016 US Presidential election?
« Reply #242 on: January 02, 2017, 08:13:50 am »

We are the system, and we are the rulers.
:laugh:

That's hilarious as you're constantly accusing me of being naive.

If I'm the dreamer, then you would be the realist, tell me then, what are the solutions? Because I see none.

I'm not the one who pulled a load of crock about a "state of low vibration".

Not sure why you keep making things personal, I thought you were more intelligent then this.

Quote
There are no solutions for the time being, since we refuse to accept we -mankind as a whole- are the reason every social construct we come up with is by design destined to fail since everything wrong you'll find there has been put there by us. Suggesting there are some nefarious hidden powers conspiring to keep mankind down is merely a childish fantasy pulled out of thin air because admitting everything ugly in society comes from us and can be found in everyone is too unpleasant to accept. The system reflects what we are and is designed to express that, hence we are the system, we are the masters. But that's something we don't want to admit, the perspective of not being the extraordinary creatures we fancy ourselves to be is so horrific we come up with fantasies about hidden powers conspiring to keep us down.

The ones complaining about elites keeping them down would do the very same if they were given the power to do so , because it's not indignation they express but jealousy. It's not against oppression they're railing up, it's against being the oppressed. Hand over the stick and they'll gladly dish out the beating.

Human civilization has been around for only a few millennia, I suppose we're still experiencing growth pains. For the time being, there's no way out.  To use a common trope, we're not ready yet for a better world. You cannot improve society as a whole if you don't admit we have to improve individually in order to achieve that.
[/quote]

You're the dreamer, I'm the realist, keep dreaming.



Offline Burkingam

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Re: Who will win the 2016 US Presidential election?
« Reply #243 on: January 02, 2017, 06:45:25 pm »
Contrarily to the popular belief, realism and cynicism are two different things.
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Offline Fool010

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Re: Who will win the 2016 US Presidential election?
« Reply #244 on: January 03, 2017, 07:32:13 am »
you : the best raw and base materials and the best builders
me : we are the makers of all ills that befall us

You're the dreamer, I'm the realist, keep dreaming.

Good to know

Contrarily to the popular belief, realism and cynicism are two different things.

Wishful thinking based on denial and escapism doesn't feel that close to realism to me neither. You don't "fix" something by pretending it doesn't exist. I don't even consider myself to be a cynic, I merely consider it's easier to act on your worst impulses since all it takes is going with  the flow while acting on the best requires effort. Few are willing to give up some of what they have for the good of others instead of taking to improve their own status, and that's pretty natural. I'm not even saying no one can be trusted, all I'm saying is that given the opportunity to get benefits at the expense of others in all impunity, only very few wouldn't take advantage.

You know the line about the end justifying the means, don't you ?

Until "us" encompasses everyone and not only those you consider to be like yourself all attempts at societal improvement are bound to fail. As I said growing pains, since mankind still functions in a tribal way with tribes having grown in scale up to the size of countries or ethnic groups, but that's understandable with an history as a civilized species spanning only a few millennia. It's not hopeless but it sure as hell is going to take longer than utopists think.

Then again, maybe failure is necessary in order for mankind to learn something .... unless of course you refuse to accept responsibility and blame everything on some diffuse external influence. In the end it's not a question of "if we ever can", it's more about "when we will be able to". If you look back at human history, it's pretty unrealistic to expect some rosy future to unfold in the coming decades, it'll more likely take a couple centuries.

While we, in developed countries, are whining about our wealth shrinking way too many people on this earth still don't have access to the most basic necessities.

You may call me a cynic, but I see no factual basis for such faith in mankind. I'd rather consider myself a skeptic but apparently skepticism is only acceptable when applied to religion, not your own species. There's some obvious bias at work from my part, but that's true on the other side of the fence too. It just happens to point in opposite directions.

So, neither dreamer, nor realist, nor cynic. I'd prefer measured optimist. Though, some studies have linked cynicism and dementia .... should we just hold hands and have happy-happy thoughts while Life of Brian's closing song plays in the background ?
« Last Edit: January 03, 2017, 10:31:13 am by Fool010 »
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Offline surdumil

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Re: Who will win the 2016 US Presidential election?
« Reply #245 on: January 03, 2017, 12:57:07 pm »
Er, I hope "society" is at least scoped down to "American Society".
The majority of humanity is NOT "American Society" and is not subjugated to American politics.
Personally, I feel no ownership to American political and societal errors.
I seem to be commenting on them though.
I've been baaaaad.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2017, 01:00:42 pm by surdumil »

Offline Tiffanys

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Re: Who will win the 2016 US Presidential election?
« Reply #246 on: January 06, 2017, 04:47:32 pm »
Here's how the election was really stolen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJ7fWV-o0nk

Offline Shiakou

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Re: Who will win the 2016 US Presidential election?
« Reply #247 on: January 07, 2017, 06:52:41 pm »
Er, I hope "society" is at least scoped down to "American Society".
The majority of humanity is NOT "American Society" and is not subjugated to American politics.
Personally, I feel no ownership to American political and societal errors.
I seem to be commenting on them though.
I've been baaaaad.

As bad as American politics can be, I am even more ashamed of my own country's politics. Our current President is basically Trump squared. He has surrendered the rule of law in exchange for mob justice, encouraged a return to chauvinism where a woman is held responsible for being raped (and a man is not to be blamed since he can't help himself for forcing himself on an attractive woman), and he publicly hurls insults and swears at American authority.

The people love him for his willingness to "talk straight" and "having balls", but all I see is a super-edgelord, whose vulgarity is used as a mask for increasing barbarism.

And no, that's not hyperbole. The man encourages citizens to explicitly kill each other over perceived wrongs instead of going to a court of law. So of course, the people treat him like a maverick cowboy cop from a B-grade action movie.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2017, 07:04:17 pm by Shiakou »