Naruto Discussion [Manga Only]

[beezer08]

Right now, Sasuke wouldn't have a chance unless Naruto still has issues with defending against Genjitsu.  It's funny because the once retarded Naruto just turned into the biggest genius almost overnight, because not only did he learn sage mode much faster than Jaraiya, his version is perfected and much MUCH stronger.  Pair that with the fact that he can can now throw his Rasen Shuriken makes me pretty sure that he's become one of, if not the strongest person we've seen so far in the manga.....and he did it in a ridiculously short amount of time.  KICK PEIN'S FUCKING ASS NARUTO! 

[vicious796]

Y'all are forgetting the last fight the two of them had where Naruto had more cards in his deck than Sasuke did and Sasuke still won with only his normal sharingan. Never underestimate the power of the schwartz.

[beezer08]

1. That was a while ago
2. Pein could probably whoop Sasuke
3. Naruto is currently shit kicking Pein
4. Juraiya>Sasuke
5. Naruto>Juraiya
6. Sage mode>>>>Cursed seal V2(which Sasuke no longer has anymore, so he has much less chakra available to him)
7. Naruto is still probably hiding something in terms of his power
8. We just saw how much trouble Sasuke had beating the 8th Jinchuriki....even with the help of 3 others
9. Imagine if Naruto could control his Jinchuriki like the 8th could
10. Sasuke seems to already be going blind after a few uses
11. Itachi taught Naruto something....and we have no clue what it is
12. Sasuke barely beat Deidara

Like I said the only way Sasuke could currently win is if he traps Naruto with illusions....that is assuming Naruto goes full out.  If he half-asses it and is only trying to save Sasuke while Sasuke is trying to kill him, then it may end up like the first time. 

[h3nta1]

now that naruto is gonna be out of sage mode, there are still two more peins left.  i think he's gonna over come the nine tail within him soon and bring that into play as well.  you saw how powerful he was with just four of this tails, now imagine having the ability of all 9 AND sage mode?  can you even comprhend what im saying without blowing a fuse?  lets just say he's like play starcraft with god mode. it'll be retarded to watch him lay waste to all his enemies he'd just fart in their general direction and they'd die.

[Sakura588]

now that naruto is gonna be out of sage mode, there are still two more peins left.  i think he's gonna over come the nine tail within him soon and bring that into play as well.  you saw how powerful he was with just four of this tails, now imagine having the ability of all 9 AND sage mode?  can you even comprhend what im saying without blowing a fuse?  lets just say he's like play starcraft with god mode. it'll be retarded to watch him lay waste to all his enemies he'd just fart in their general direction and they'd die.

he'd probably start owning until aldaris pops up and tells him he needs additional pylons

[furuoshiki]

Guys lets calm down and figure out the facts first:

Disclaimer: All of this is merely astute speculation

1) Sage mode is perfected but what are the drawbacks?

- How long can it be used?
- If not long, how long before it can be used again?

2) Sasuke is not done training. From foreshadowing there are still some possibilities of Sasuke learning yet another Jutsu.

3) The "Ability" that Itachi gave Naruto has not yet been revealed, or it's possible drawbacks.

4) As predicted by the fans...Will Sage mode actually cancel out the Damage caused by the Kyubi? If so can they be used in conjunction? It is unlikely Naruto can simultaneously use the two abilities yet.

5) Naruto > Jiraiya? Hmmm...something is fishy here.

6) Jiraiya > Sasuke? Hmmm....Did Jiraiya take it easy on Pein because he was a former student? Did he lose only because he let his guard down? If so, can it be said that Jiraiya could still be considered theoretically (in retrospect) stronger than Pein? Also does Jiraiya continue to take it easy or hold back against Orochimaru? I believe if Sarutobi for example fought Orochimaru with the intent to kill from the very beginning he would have not had to use the Shinigami Jutsu and would have defeated him and been able to keep his life. I believe Jiraiya suffers from this same compassion which of course means DEATH in the Ninja world. On another note, Sasuke barely defeated Orochimaru on his own by absorbing him via the Sharingan but in the end it was Itachi who defeated Orochimaru with Susano'Oh if I remember correctly. Yet another problem is that Orochimaru was probably holding back against Sasuke because he cannot damage the body that he needs to occupy, so he was possibly restricted to using Genjutsu and non-lethal techniques. I am not sure but I think Masashi Kishimoto did not explain some of these possible hidden intentions for a reason.

Orochimaru also supposedly is not dead yet because Kabuto absorbed part of his flesh.

If you remember the Sanin fight as well Jiraiya and Tsunade both at half strength could not defeat Orochimaru.

 Orochimaru is strong because he used forbidden techniques and sacrificed his humanity. Anyone who is not insanely stronger than him can only hope to defeat him by also sacrificing their humanity. If you remember Naruto could only land a single blow (which was a critical but not fatal hit) on Orochimaru while in 4 tail-kyuubi mode. While I'm sure 8-9 tails could overwhelm him completely, it would also overwhelm Naruto and consume him, thus supporting the theory I proposed above.

You may be thinking I am going on a tangent but this comes full circle. If Orochimaru isn't dead yet then Sasuke's strength and the limits of the Sharingan is put into question. What powers does Orochimaru posses that can circumvent the ability of the Sharingan? How come the Kyuubi who is much stronger Chakra wise submitted to the Sharingan while Orochimaru was able to deflect it to some degree? Because of these open ended loopholes in the plot we cannot consider Sasuke's or Jiraiya's strength as quantifiable and cannot compare them with each other properly or with anyone else, Naruto included.

Because of these factors the fight between Naruto and Pein will likely end in a stalemate via interruption because we do not know the actions, locations, livelihood, or intentions of the following nin:

- Kabuto & Orochimaru
- Sasuke (we know his intention but not his location or current actions)
- Uchiha Madara AKA tobi
- Danzo-sama AKA the jerkwad
- Any missing-nin
- Other villages/Possible support from Sand/Gaara/etc
 
Another last hole in the plot: What are the drawbacks from using the Rinnegan aside from the long-term life-sapping qualities? What are the short-term drawbacks?

[furuoshiki]

This is a truly great series because Masashi Kishimoto thought the logistics of this series out very thoroughly which will not let even the most astute fans of the ninja or fighting genres properly analyze strength simply based on fights themselves; but which require information of origins and the nin's intentions and history to gain a proper perspective on the reason for the outcome of the fight.

[Penthero]

Jiraya didn't use sage-mode versus Orochimaru, and if I remember correctly Orochimaru were pretty sick/bad condition when he lost to Sasuke and during the sennin fight(he couldn't use his arms), so I find it hard to judge their abilities from those battles. But I do believe Jiraya/Orochimaru would be able to fight pretty equal, and they are most likely stronger than Sasuke(Jiraya should have been able to protect himself against the Genjutsu in sage mide).

I do doubt though that Naruto will currently be able to kill Pain, as they haven't figured out his secret yet, and he's said to be impossible to beat until you figure it out. Even with all his bodies beaten Pain would just be able to get new ones...

Depending on the power Itachi gave Naruto, Naruto will either be able to fair equally to Sasuke or get his ass kicked like last time. Sasukes genjutsu and Amaterasu are powers which  easily can defeat Naruto if he's not prepared for them, unless ofcourse he go Kyuubi and loses control over himself as I doubt he's able to control it as he's stopped using it after he injured Sakura.

[Sakura588]

With regards to the power Itachi gave Naruto, I think it is safe to assume it was something weak enough not to kill Sasuke, but strong enough to stop him (and "save" him, as Itachi wanted; I think he truly understood the bond between Naruto and Sasuke and how that will be the way he can save the brother he forsook for the sake of protecting him)

[beezer08]

5) Naruto > Jiraiya? Hmmm...something is fishy here.

In terms of their sage mode, Naruto's has already said to be much stronger than Jiraiya's due to the fact that its the perfected version.....and since sage mode was considered Jiraiya's best technique, I'd say its a good bet. 

As for Sasuke killing Orichimaru, you have to remember than he was severely weakened at the time and it was pretty much a sneak attack...and as for Jiraiya I'm pretty sure his intent was to never kill Orichimaru in their other battles in which Orichimaru was healthy, which is why he never activated sage mode.  Tsunade's strength on the other hand is somewhat of a mystery....at times she looks really strong and at others(like right now) she looks rather weak.  It's obvious she's a medical expert first and a fighter second.

If anything the real issue is how fast Naruto just grew in terms of strength....because 20 or so chapters ago I'd say Sasuke was the stronger one, but now after him learning sage mode(which seems godly) and Sasuke getting his ass kicked by the other Jinchuriki it seems to be no contest.

[furuoshiki]

But I do believe Jiraya/Orochimaru would be able to fight pretty equal, and they are most likely stronger than Sasuke(Jiraya should have been able to protect himself against the Genjutsu in sage mide).

I do doubt though that Naruto will currently be able to kill Pain, as they haven't figured out his secret yet, and he's said to be impossible to beat until you figure it out.

Good points.

OK so let's start from the beginning and assume:

Orochimaru = Jiraiya = Tsunade

Jiraiya > Naruto 4 Kyuubi Tails (remember the training session? apparently he was able to defeat him without Yamato which is quite impressive. Maybe it is safe to say in this respect that Yamato + Kakashi = Jiraiya? Since they also had to control him while in this stage?)

Orochimaru also > Naruto 4 Kyuubi Tails

Sasuke > Normal Naruto (no Kyuubi tails)

HOWEVER:

Sasuke < Killer Bee Biju

Killer Bee Biju = Raikage?

This means that Killer Bee is stronger than Naruto, especially because Killer Bee can effectively turn full Biju and maintain his will where Naruto cannot. This means that Killer Bee is on the same level as a Sannin/Hokage or possibly stronger.

I think 2 Akatsuki = One Sannin because....

Jiraiya had to use a summon against Itachi and Kisame but did not use Sage mode. So possibly we can say Jiraiya is stronger than Itachi. (The cost for using sage mode is far less than the cost for using the Mangekyou Sharingan, so advantage Jiraiya) Remember too that Itachi could have beaten Sasuke if he wanted to. So this means that Jiraiya > Sasuke.

If Itachi were still alive I think he would be stronger than Sasuke and I think that Jiraiya in Sage Mode + The frog song from the elders would cancel out Itachi's Mangekyou Sharingan. So I think that the elder frogs were jumping the gun in saying that Naruto in sage mode surpassed Jiraiya. I think that they meant he was stronger than Jiraiya when he first was learning sage mode but I don't think he is stronger than the Jiraiya that just died. (I know you are dizzy after reading this paragraph, sorry )

Another thing I completely forgot. Everyone has to remember that Sasuke effectively lost the battle against Killer Bee and had to run away. For some reason or another Killer Bee cannot be killed with Genjutsu alone even though supposedly the tailed beasts are weak against Genjutsu users, the Uchiha Sharingan in particular.

Now another loophole I think of is that Sasuke is weaker than Madara, However Madara cannot use Jutsu in front of Sasuke or the Amaterasu will activate. But let us assume they will not fight each other since they have the same objective.

As to your other point about Pein's secret...I think Tsunade mentioned the secret has been found out. At the end of one of the more recent chapters Pein for some reason assumed Tsunade decrypted the secret from the info gotten from the dead body examined by Shizune. She put Chakra in her hands and feet for some reason. Does this mean she knows the weakness of the Rinnegan?

Also@Beezer, yeah Tsunade is definitely a medical ninja first. But her power is equal to the other Sannin because she literally saved 99% of the villagers with the summoning jutsu slug (whatever her name is, i forgot). I think the slug can not only heal but absorb chakra attacks. I think it's only weak to Taijutsu which only one of pein's bodies use.

Overall I feel that Pein can be defeated if multiple high level nin are involved in the fight. Another problem is Sasuke and Madara wanting to destroy Konoha. It is already in ruins.

Did they mean the just village itself? I doubt it, I think they meant the people. Especially considering the concept of the "Will of Fire" that will continue to burn regardless if the village itself exists or not physically.

[beezer08]

So I think that the elder frogs were jumping the gun in saying that Naruto in sage mode surpassed Jiraiya. I think that they meant he was stronger than Jiraiya when he first was learning sage mode but I don't think he is stronger than the Jiraiya that just died.

You have to remember tho that the elder frog personally said Naruto surpassed those before him(Chapter 430) which also includes Jiraiya and the fourth Hokage if you look at the images.  Now that's not to say that Naruto is stronger than the 4th(he probably isn't even close)....its just that his sage mode is probably the most perfected and the strongest out of the bunch.  Sure not having the frogs attached to him gives him a bit of a disadvantage in the genjitsu field and starting the transformation, but I'm pretty sure Naruto found another way to initiate the process while moving like he said he was going to.  I also have a feeling he might utilize the Kyuubi as well in a new way.

My take on it is this from what I saw/remember: 
Sage mode>4 tail Kyuubi due to the fact that he actually has control and isn't attacking randomly.  In terms of brute power tho its the opposite.
Orichimaru>4 tail Kyuubi....but only barely because he had to pull out all the stops.  Jiraiya is also obviously stronger than 4 tails. 
Itachi>Orichimaru....shouldn't be an argument here
Juraiya>Itachi.....because Itachi had to run away even with a partner. 
Pein>Jiraiya  You may think he was going easy on him because he was his student, but he still couldn't defend himself at the very end :'( and he only got one body.  He may have won if he figured out Pein's secret quicker...but he was too late. 
Naruto's Sage mode>Sannin....Already mentioned why with Jiraiya and I think Jiraiya>Orichimaru>>Tsunade in terms of fighting skill.  Don't misunderstand here tho.  Jiraiya would probably be even or better than Naruto in battle due to his fighting experience, but Naruto's strength is still most likely higher.
Killerbee is ? than Naruto...only because we have no idea what else Naruto has in store for us.  As of this second I think Killerbee has the slight upper hand. 

I have a feeling we'll get a better idea of "power rankings" after this battle with Pein, because it all hinges on Naruto and whatever else he pulls out.

[furuoshiki]

Okay so if this logic works out this means that with Sage Mode Naruto is possibly stronger than Sasuke. But we can assume that he isn't stronger than Killer Bee since Killer Bee can control the full strength of his Biju (more efficiently) as well as the simple age advantage where Naruto is only 15 and Killer Bee is at least slightly older.

Naruto may have perfected the initial Sage Mode but it does not appear that he can use enough variety of the Sage techniques to outsmart Sasuke or even Pein for that matter. Unfortunately, Naruto's main weakness is his redundancy and stupidity. What he lacks in the brain department he makes up for in charm and surprises. Well let's hope Naruto's surprise is overwhelming enough to defeat Pein and friends.

But the problem is too that the final enemy will not be Pein, it will become incredibly hard for Naruto to learn new Jutsu with both of his teacher's dead. As far as we know Jiraiya has kicked the bucket and Kakashi may or may not be dead. Iruka can no longer help Naruto as he is completely out of his league. Konoha must also deal with:

- Madara
- Danzo and possibly some S-class ANBU rogue nin
- Sasuke and team "Hawk"
- Orochimaru (death not confirmed) + Kabuto
- Possibly another village Kage looking for power
- Konan and the remaining Akatsuki

Potential Allies:

- Sand Village + Gaara
- Smaller villages looking for protection
- Danzou himself (temporarily if another threat is present, collaboration with the threat is unlikely and iffy/conditional)
- Madara (his intentions are still unknown...why has he waited until now to claim to Sasuke that his mission continues to be the eradication of Konoha? Why didn't he strike right after Orochimaru forced Sarutobi to seal himself? That would have been the perfect time. Why did he assist Pein and why is he currently keeping an eye on him? Could he be possibly manipulating Danzou and the elders from the start?)

Actually now that you mentioned whether or not Naruto was stronger than the Yondaime I have to say he inherently wields the potential to be stronger but has not reached that point yet:

1) Because he is the Yondaime's son (or at least that is what we are hinted at)
2) Because he has the Kyuubi inside of him who forced the Yondaime to use the forbidden technique, technically making the Yondaime the weaker opponent in that battle for having to resort to that.

This raises the question concerning Madara:

If Madara was able to control and force the Biju to attempt and destroy Konoha of his own will, could he have not defeated the Yondaime with his own hands in a fair fight just as easily? This raises questions of why Madara chooses to hide in the shadows instead of taking his revenge on Konoha directly. Is there some reason he cannot do this? Was there some power the Yondaime held that Madara could not defeat in a face-to-face battle?

I can understand Madara not being able to kill all 3 sannin and 2 hokage at the same time. But I think it's safe to assume the 3 sannin may have not all been present at the time Madara chose to attack the village and 1 of them being a dissenter (orochimaru) wouldn't have gone against him (or would he?). Technically the Senju clan are the winners of the fight over Konoha.

Considering their are no more Senju alive (except for Yamato who is not really authentic and probably less potent) who exactly is Madara afraid of? Did Madara really lose the fight against the first kage of konoha? Or did he merely lose the popularity contest?

[beezer08]

I do agree with most of what you said, except these things:

1. Naruto's teachers may very well both be dead(PLEASE LIVE KAKASHI!)...but that's not to say he still can't learn new moves on his own.  He can still obtain scrolls and learn from them like he did in the beginning of the show, make shit up on his own(like throwing Rasenshuriken), or find another suitable teacher(like the frogs).  Another thing we are also forgetting is that Naruto doesn't even know his second element yet, which will obviously effect who his teacher could/will be. 

2.  I'm 99% sure Naruto with Sage mode could whoop Sasuke and the only way the opposite would occur is if Genjitsu was used and Naruto still sucks at defending against it.  Sasuke would have had a better chance if he still had his cursed seal to draw extra chakra from or if had the perfected version of his sharingan so he could use Amaterasu more than once.  Another issue Sasuke has is that his ultimate move(lightning bolt) can be easily countered by Naruto's due to elemental strengths and the fact that Naruto's seems to be much much stronger.  Sasuke does also possess fire techniques as well which would counter Naruto's wind moves, but he never uses them in his style as much as he does lightning attacks....and unless I missed something, all of his fire attacks are long range and none are higher than a B rank.  Sasuke would beat Naruto normally, but when Naruto hits sage mode he becomes like 2-3 times stronger and I don't think Sasuke could handle that right now.  I also don't think Naruto's lack of variety in sage techniques will matter much either because they all are incredibly powerful and Sasuke has no idea about them in the first place.....unlike Pein who has already fought Jiraiya. 

3.  Naruto has proven enough to show that he no longer falls in the stupid category when it comes to learning techniques and fighting.  He may still be obnoxious when not in battle but in his last and current fight he has shown that he has become much MUCH smarter.  He no longer seems to waste clones when he fights and now takes the most efficient route to victory(see Kakuzu fight).  Needless to say tho, he still nowhere near as smart as Sasuke....who seems to always have to do more with less. 

[furuoshiki]

Regarding #1 & 2-

According to the series, Naruto cannot handle Genjutsu yet. If he suddenly can after the Frog training the series neglected to fill us in on that development. The last time our poor boy encountered Genjutsu from Itachi he was clearly out of his league and caught in the trance.

Naruto may be stronger chakra wise to Itachi or Kakashi but the effectiveness and speed of his Jutsu is questionable in comparison Sharingan users. Jiraiya has had 30+ years dealing with his weakness and has come up with more than a couple of pre-thought out plans to counter it in battle.

While Naruto was indeed taught by the frogs he hasn't had as much training by himself or life experience as Jiraiya. Jiraiya is well versed in battle because of his travels and studying other nin in other villages. You have to realize just how amazing it was for Jiraiya to be able to find out Pein's secret IN THE MIDST OF BATTLE, and Konoha with all it's powerful nin cannot keep him contained when they know more about him from the start than Jiraiya did.

I am guessing this is why Jiraiya opted for a pre-emptive surprise attack on their territory, to prevent this from happening in the first place. This is why I have to say that Jiraiya may be similar to Naruto but he has certainly overcome his dumbness and thickheaded nature where as Naruto is progressing but not quite at that level yet.

Also the time limit on Sage mode is the Achilles heel, not to jump the gun but the latest episode shows Naruto sweating and out of breath after taking out only 2 of pein's bodies. Not so good. (Last I remember Jiraiya took out 3 or 4? and I think he maintained sage mode until death.) Sasuke and friends on the other hand will not share the same apathy as Pein who after using "that" technique, clearly has no regard for his livelihood or the Akatsuki in general. They will simply hide until his Sage Mode runs out and then come back with Amaterasu which Naruto won't be able to dodge if he is tired and cannot make Kage Bunshin. But then again maybe the technique Itachi gave to Naruto will come into play to either disable the Amaterasu or the Mangekyou Sharingan altogether.

[vicious796]

Slow down people, power isn't everything. Intelligence is what makes a real ninja a real ninja. Look at Shikamaru, weak as fuck but I wouldn't mess with him. Also, let's rethink our position on Sasuke and the 8 tails by looking at everything:

Sasuke went into battle with a new "goodie" that he doesn't know how to use yet. The only thing he knows how to do is amaratsu and he isn't even 100% on it. He also used some of his power to put out the flames. The problem is, how do you train with something that robs you of so much?

The 8 tails was/is also capable of using his beast to the fullest. Naruto, not so much. Sasuke was also still a little dinged up after his fight with Itachi.

1 on 1, even with Sage Mode, I don't know if Naruto is capable of out-doing Sasuke. It's the brains people, Naruto doesn't have them. Itachi power is something different, we don't know what it is.

NOW, as to how the story can/will play out right now.

Naruto seems to be out of gas. As always, he's in need of help from some outside source. Let's take into consideration the possible allies he has in his corner:

1.) Shikamaru. He was just told to sit out and his leg is broken but lord knows that doesn't mean anything.
2.) Tsunade. She's a little worn out right now. Healing an entire village at one time takes alot out of you.
3.) Sakura. Useless.
4.) Neji. He could do somethan.
5.) Hinata. Maybe?
6.) The rest of his little friends. Lord knows they'll come together.
7.) Let's not forget, Sasuke may be trying to fool Madara. Put Hawk here as a maybe.
8.) Let's also not forget, we don't know a GOD DAMN THING about Uzumaki Kushina. She may even show up and become his next "teacher".
9.) The man is surrounded by huge frogs. I believe they can buy him some time.

[beezer08]

First of all I don't think Naruto is out of gas since I'm pretty sure his own chakra is still strong because he doesn't use as much as he normally would while in sage mode.  I also don't think anyone can come to the rescue this time since everyone seems too beat up to give him a hand.....and its not like they'll make a big difference against Pein anyway.  I have a feeling he'll either re initiate sage mode while moving(like he said he would try) or he'll call upon the kyuubi.  The other possibility is that Pein stops attacking the village and stops his pursuit of Naruto since he doesn't yet know that they failed to capture the 8th Jinchuriki....which they said they need to extract before the 9th else the whole thing would be ruined.   

Secondly for the last time, Naruto does have brains and the power to back it up.  If you want a good example of how he uses them, just take a look at his battle with Kakuzu.  Kakuzu was an incredibly intelligent ninja(who rivals Skikamaru) who was very talented as well and he still got destroyed by Naruto and his new move even though he was doing everything to avoid it.  He may not be as intelligent as Sasuke, but he's not an idiot either. 

@furuo:  I'm pretty sure Naruto has taken out 4 of Pein's bodies.  1-Rasengan when he made his appearance and saved Tsunade.  2-Nailed with a frog katta. 3- Inside the mouth of the frog. 4- Throwing Rasenshuriken 

[vicious796]

I forgot about the 8 tails needing to be captured first. I believe Pein will get him to a weak spot and then fall back.

[Penthero]

I forgot about the 8 tails needing to be captured first. I believe Pein will get him to a weak spot and then fall back.

Wouldn't it be easier to just capture Naruto there? So they won't need to repeat the hassle to get him again...Otherwise Itachi showing up in the village earlier wouldn't make sense.

[furuoshiki]

Slow down people, power isn't everything. Intelligence is what makes a real ninja a real ninja. Look at Shikamaru, weak as fuck but I wouldn't mess with him.

Naruto seems to be out of gas. As always, he's in need of help from some outside source. Let's take into consideration the possible allies he has in his corner:

1.) Shikamaru. He was just told to sit out and his leg is broken but lord knows that doesn't mean anything.
8.) Let's also not forget, we don't know a GOD DAMN THING about Uzumaki Kushina. She may even show up and become his next "teacher".

I agree with Shikamaru not being down for the count yet.

And yes Naruto's mother...did she really die during childbirth as I am sure most of us assumed? But then again I remember that the beast was trapped inside of Naruto AFTER he was born. If Naruto's mother is alive that would be a nice but suspicious plot twist that would need some big explaining. Especially because of the fact of Naruto's tough parentless child hood. This connects to the only doubt I have of Minato being Naruto's father, (if he was, wouldn't people have respected him more regardless of his nature or what is inside of him? Or conversely BECAUSE of the burden inside of him?) Wasn't too nice of Sarutobi and Jiraiya to just die without at least hinting at these things.

I agree that Naruto may have gotten some common sense, but honestly who changes greatly in just TWO YEARS? Beezer I think you are taking it a little bit to easy on our boy here:

Secondly for the last time, Naruto does have brains and the power to back it up.  If you want a good example of how he uses them, just take a look at his battle with Kakuzu.  Kakuzu was an incredibly intelligent ninja(who rivals Skikamaru) who was very talented as well and he still got destroyed by Naruto and his new move even though he was doing everything to avoid it.  He may not be as intelligent as Sasuke, but he's not an idiot either. 

@furuo:  I'm pretty sure Naruto has taken out 4 of Pein's bodies.  1-Rasengan when he made his appearance and saved Tsunade.  2-Nailed with a frog katta. 3- Inside the mouth of the frog. 4- Throwing Rasenshuriken 

Honestly compared to Hidan, Kakuzu was a complete idiot that needed more hearts due to his arrogance probably ordinarily getting him close to death too easily. I don't think Kakuzu is the poster brain child for the Akatsuki.... If Kakashi wasn't worn down from fighting the clay bird dude I am sure he would have handily whooped Kakuzu's ass. While we shouldn't expect Naruto to have anywhere near the intelligence capacity of the Uchiha clan, as vicious says he cannot possibly defeat Sasuke if he intends to rely solely on surprises.

Honestly I haven't seen anything truly innovative (in terms of variety, not just power) from Naruto since the Chunnin Exam against Neji when he dug under ground and left a Bunshin Kawamiri where he got hit. Now that wasn't just a cool move, but it was a Shikamaru level tactic worthy of praise.

As for Naruto's stamina I wouldn't count on the Kyuubi being used here. Even though Natural energy is mostly coming from the environment he still isn't used to using it, and because of the expedited training he is probably using just as much Chakra as it takes to handle the Kyuubi Chakra. Just remember that if Naruto goes berserk it's all over and Konoha loses for sure. Why?:

1)Yamato is probably exhausted
2) Uh it's the Akatsuki's goal to extract the Biju from the Jinchurriki, if he unleashes the Kyuubi this makes life a hell of a lot easier and less complicated for Pein.
3) Madara can come in do what he did last time, potentially.

Looks like Vicious' prediction of back-up coming will come to pass.

However the following question comes to mind:

Where the fuck is Team Gai when you really need them???

P.S. - Killer Bee's strength right now is probably unfathomable/cannot be compared to anyone right now. Even though Sasuke was weakened from the previous fight Killer Bee escaped the Amaterasu, something which is famed for being inescapable. Also he appears to be relatively comfortable in dealing with Genjutsu compared to Naruto and Jiraiya, and is second to none in Taijutsu. Through process of elimination I am assuming only Ninjutsu can defeat him. I doubt Killer Bee will become an enemy of Konoha but he should keep Pein very busy at least until Naruto becomes smarter and stronger. I don't want to be biased but anyone who can only understand Natural Energy (Qi Gong in our Universe) by comparing it to an ice-cream swirl has to be an incredibly thick-headed dude.  This goes for Gamakichi as well for proposing that analogy.