Author Topic: Windows 7 and general bitching about OSes (Read 102354 times)

Sakura588 · « **Reply #200 on:** February 17, 2009, 04:44:05 PM »

If you read more than just the main article, I think you'll find just how wrong the guy who posted that article really is...

mgz · « **Reply #201 on:** February 17, 2009, 05:10:50 PM »

i think your nearing the side of paranoia because as long as your computer functions while not on the internet. Which im pretty sure people dont have problems with.
But the only people who have real issues with DRM shit are people who typically are lesser affected by its effects in their OS. Because they use more programs to do shit in different ways.

dankles · « **Reply #202 on:** February 17, 2009, 05:37:05 PM »

Ignorance is bliss to some people. Then they try to justify it.
Anyways... I don't care how much you flame me, because I disagree and you can disagree with me. blah blah blah

mgz · « **Reply #203 on:** February 17, 2009, 05:40:42 PM »

im not flaming you, just think you are blowing out of proportion how much their DRM actually affects your usage of the software and its functionality

dankles · « **Reply #204 on:** February 17, 2009, 05:48:41 PM »

Quote from: mgz on February 17, 2009, 05:40:42 PM

im not flaming you, just think you are blowing out of proportion how much their DRM actually affects your usage of the software and its functionality

My fear is mostly what DRM can do and not what it has done. Although there are many examples of things gone wrong with DRM in history (i've posted a few). I just feel that in the wrong hands in the future it will seriously turn against us. The most scary example is the vista License agreement that says that Microsoft owns you OS. Therefore, being owners they can do as they wish *if* they wish it. And my comment was to show that Win7 will probably do the same.
Am I paranoid? A bit, but I feel that I am right to be so.

AceHigh · « **Reply #205 on:** February 17, 2009, 06:31:51 PM »

You are paranoid, a lot.

Licence agreements like that are made for legal reasons, not to turn your computer into Skynet.

Quote

Therefore, being owners they can do as they wish *if* they wish it.

Yeah, well they still can't knock down the door into my house to take it away from me. What are they going to do? Invalidate my copy? Now that would be shooting themselves in the foot. It will backfire by more piracy. Yes, you heard me, more piracy instead of people switching to other OS.

tactics · « **Reply #206 on:** February 17, 2009, 06:32:46 PM »

Let me sum up a few things with crappy English:

Should I go linux?

* if you play all sorts of games that aren't known to run well with wine or are into pro-anything that involves interacting with gui then linux isn't for you
* if all you do is masturbate to porn and listen to music, then the only things left that could get incredibly frustrating are hardware-related problems

Are there any sure ways to raise productiveness (maximized/non-maximized windows aside)?

* go dualscreen

Getting bsod with vista 7?

* it's beta for a reason

Oppose drm?

* well, it's not like anybody is forcing you. If you truly cared about your freedoms, then you wouldn't be using any sort of closed-source os in the first place.

Vista interface is a waste of space!

* wait till you see a typical linux distribution interface

Vista/XP ui designers don't care about users!

* wait till you see a typical linux distribution interface
* there are ways around it

All windows os's bleed my eyes in dark room!

* wait till you see a typical linux distribution interface

AceHigh · « **Reply #207 on:** February 17, 2009, 06:35:31 PM »

Bwhahahahahaha

* Dragoon AceHigh highfives tactics.

True, Ubuntu really makes your eyes bleed. That horrible wallpaper was the first thing to go.

dankles · « **Reply #208 on:** February 17, 2009, 06:53:13 PM »

Quote from: Dragoon AceHigh on February 17, 2009, 06:31:51 PM

You are paranoid, a lot.

No I'm not. Don't belittle me when you're saying that I'm something and yet you don't even know me.

AceHigh · « **Reply #209 on:** February 17, 2009, 07:07:45 PM »

By expressing your opinions you reveal things about yourself, the more you do them more I know about you. And from your posts on DRM I know that you are paranoid.

I bet you think RFID in national cards is a thing of a grand conspiracy.

xShadow · « **Reply #210 on:** February 17, 2009, 07:14:12 PM »

mgz (and others), the reason I stopped a long time ago was because he's like a parrot that only knows how to paraphrase himself, ad infinitum. I don't suggest getting involved in this. I've already brought this up, and he responded the exact same damned way.... oh, and apparently he also never "left" the debate. Naturally, anything is worse than not being able to try to spread Linux like it's the OPERATING SYSTEM OF GOD (or Chuck Norris; whichever you prefer. I go with Chuck Norris, because I am fond of internet memes and whatnot).

Anyway, I also wanted to point out one huge factor here (when it comes to businesses, anyway): Linux has no real tech support. There are apparently some private sites that charge rates, but there is no "official" tech support. If you own a business of like 300+ employees, most of which are working on computers, you're bound to have some problems with the machines. What are you gonna do, hire a set of ten teenage "Linux pros" to sort your shit out? Get on some forums and ask questions which take forever to get to the root of your problem? I mean, I dunno, but I'd rather not screw around with an OS where (if I'm in a really bad spot) I know that I don't have any solid tech support that could help me. It's around the same reason why people choose "Dell" or something, over building their own computer (not that this is the same case, anyway; buying a Dell is always a bad choice. Installing Windows is not. >_>).

As it is now, Linux can't compete with Microsoft. Mac, on the other hand, is already starting to (kinda). If you wanna note anything, note the differences between Linux and Mac, and you'll have why I say this.

dankles · « **Reply #211 on:** February 17, 2009, 07:17:47 PM »

Quote from: Dragoon AceHigh on February 17, 2009, 07:07:45 PM

I bet you think RFID in national cards is a thing of a grand conspiracy.

In a sense... yes lol
If the government is able to track me then other people can too.
You like the idea?
Not liking it is different from Paranoid though. It's not like I'm not going to go kill someone to stop it or anything of the sort.
And with DRM, I avoid it when I can (and express to others that they should do the same), but sometimes I am forced to use it therefore I do. Thats not "a lot" paranoid.

bcr123 · « **Reply #212 on:** February 17, 2009, 07:27:26 PM »

Quote from: xShadow on February 17, 2009, 07:14:12 PM

Anyway, I also wanted to point out one huge factor here (when it comes to businesses, anyway): Linux has no real tech support. There are apparently some private sites that charge rates, but there is no "official" tech support. If you own a business of like 300+ employees, most of which are working on computers, you're bound to have some problems with the machines. What are you gonna do, hire a set of ten teenage "Linux pros" to sort your shit out? Get on some forums and ask questions which take forever to get to the root of your problem? I mean, I dunno, but I'd rather not screw around with an OS where (if I'm in a really bad spot) I know that I don't have any solid tech support that could help me. It's around the same reason why people choose "Dell" or something, over building their own computer (not that this is the same case, anyway; buying a Dell is always a bad choice. Installing Windows is not. >_>).

As it is now, Linux can't compete with Microsoft. Mac, on the other hand, is already starting to (kinda). If you wanna note anything, note the differences between Linux and Mac, and you'll have why I say this.

Bad example. This is exactly why businesses use Redhat because they provide front line tech support same deal as Microsoft.

AceHigh · « **Reply #213 on:** February 17, 2009, 07:34:29 PM »

Quote from: dankles on February 17, 2009, 07:17:47 PM

Quote from: Dragoon AceHigh on February 17, 2009, 07:07:45 PM
I bet you think RFID in national cards is a thing of a grand conspiracy.
In a sense... yes lol
If the government is able to track me then other people can too.
You like the idea?
Not liking it is different from Paranoid though. It's not like I'm not going to go kill someone to stop it or anything of the sort.
And with DRM, I avoid it when I can (and express to others that they should do the same), but sometimes I am forced to use it therefore I do. Thats not "a lot" paranoid.

Well, I am working with RFID (among other things) and I just happen to know enough about it not to worry. Scanning detection is never above 10 meters so it's a horrible tracking device. For a good tracking you need an active RFID which means it need power to function.

Of course you don't have that in normal RFID so there are about 1000 practical uses where RFID really makes your life easier and doesn't intrude into your privacy. I never understood this paranoia people like you have, you are walking around with a cellphone and are worried about DRM and RFID. Jeeeeeeesus... I mean... Chuck Norrisssssss!

Also killing has nothing to do with paranoia, and you are paranoid.

dankles · « **Reply #214 on:** February 17, 2009, 07:36:21 PM »

@xShadow:
You refer to community distros. But look at this:
http://www.novell.com/home/index.html
http://www.redhat.com/

So I'm not sure what you mean.

And some real-life organizations that run linux:
[rul]http://www.novell.com/success/[/url]
http://www.novell.com/servlet/CRS?reference_name=&-op=%25&Action=Start+Search&Submit=Start+Search&source=novl&full_text_limit=showcase_verbiage+%2C+press_release&MaxRows=0&&solutions=3&&language_id=0&region_id=0&country_id=0&industry=0
http://www.novell.com/servlet/CRS?reference_name=&-op=%25&Action=Start+Search&Submit=Start+Search&source=novl&full_text_limit=showcase_verbiage+%2C+press_release&MaxRows=0&&solutions=1&&language_id=0&region_id=0&country_id=0&industry=0
http://www.slideshare.net/tridiaS100mktg/home-depot-case-study-presentation
http://www.novell.com/success/tokyo_it.html
http://www.aaxnet.com/design/linux2.html
http://www.packtpub.com/article/de_bortoli_wines_embraces_open_source
http://www.redhat.com/solutions/info/casestudies/

the list goes on....

xShadow · « **Reply #215 on:** February 17, 2009, 08:02:16 PM »

Quote from: bcr123 on February 17, 2009, 07:27:26 PM

Quote from: xShadow on February 17, 2009, 07:14:12 PM
Anyway, I also wanted to point out one huge factor here (when it comes to businesses, anyway): Linux has no real tech support. There are apparently some private sites that charge rates, but there is no "official" tech support. If you own a business of like 300+ employees, most of which are working on computers, you're bound to have some problems with the machines. What are you gonna do, hire a set of ten teenage "Linux pros" to sort your shit out? Get on some forums and ask questions which take forever to get to the root of your problem? I mean, I dunno, but I'd rather not screw around with an OS where (if I'm in a really bad spot) I know that I don't have any solid tech support that could help me. It's around the same reason why people choose "Dell" or something, over building their own computer (not that this is the same case, anyway; buying a Dell is always a bad choice. Installing Windows is not. >_>).

As it is now, Linux can't compete with Microsoft. Mac, on the other hand, is already starting to (kinda). If you wanna note anything, note the differences between Linux and Mac, and you'll have why I say this.

Bad example. This is exactly why businesses use Redhat because they provide front line tech support same deal as Microsoft.

Oh, really? Never heard about that. I guess it is a bad example; my mistake.

... though, that isn't a free operating system anymore. You are now paying for an OS. It's like Windows: Linux Edition, or something. If companies want to cut down maximum on costs, I would think that they were speaking of a free distro, not one you have to pay for...

Also, I'm still wondering (despite it being paid for) if there's some hardware that it can't work with, that might cause problems. Well, that's all irrelevant. You refuted my original point.

Quote from: dankles on February 17, 2009, 07:36:21 PM

@xShadow:
You refer to community distros. But look at this:
http://www.novell.com/home/index.html
http://www.redhat.com/

So I'm not sure what you mean.

And some real-life organizations that run linux:
[rul]http://www.novell.com/success/[/url]
http://www.novell.com/servlet/CRS?reference_name=&-op=%25&Action=Start+Search&Submit=Start+Search&source=novl&full_text_limit=showcase_verbiage+%2C+press_release&MaxRows=0&&solutions=3&&language_id=0&region_id=0&country_id=0&industry=0
http://www.novell.com/servlet/CRS?reference_name=&-op=%25&Action=Start+Search&Submit=Start+Search&source=novl&full_text_limit=showcase_verbiage+%2C+press_release&MaxRows=0&&solutions=1&&language_id=0&region_id=0&country_id=0&industry=0
http://www.slideshare.net/tridiaS100mktg/home-depot-case-study-presentation
http://www.novell.com/success/tokyo_it.html
http://www.aaxnet.com/design/linux2.html
http://www.packtpub.com/article/de_bortoli_wines_embraces_open_source
http://www.redhat.com/solutions/info/casestudies/

the list goes on....

You have around four sources, and none of them are really telling me much, except that there are people who switched to Linux and then found themselves happy with it... at first. First of all, how many of these people are just using Linux for a server? I've always known that Linux was a good server OS, but how many actually started using it for office procedures, and are still happy with doing so? Also, most of these success stories are hosted by something that is biased towards Linux in the first place. That's not telling me much.

Okay, so Redhat has support, but I still can't see it competing with Windows very well, considering you have to pay for both of them. It's natural for small businesses to take risks, but I can't see many big ones doing the same.

But fine, I'll give you your point: Linux can be used successfully in a business environment. Fine... but I'm still failing to see how it's "better" at it. Most of your posts involved saying something to the extent of "Linux kicks Windows' ass at everything." I'm fine with saying that it can do most things that Windows can, but you saying that it's "better" is quite a stretch.

dankles · « **Reply #216 on:** February 17, 2009, 08:12:41 PM »

Quote from: xShadow on February 17, 2009, 08:02:16 PM

But fine, I'll give you your point: Linux can be used successfully in a business environment. Fine... but I'm still failing to see how it's "better" at it. Most of your posts involved saying something to the extent of "Linux kicks Windows' ass at everything." I'm fine with saying that it can do most things that Windows can, but you saying that it's "better" is quite a stretch.

We agree in opposites, because I don't understand why Windows has to be "better" lol
Why I call linux "better" is for many reasons:
-Biggest reason is I just plain like it
-no drm (don't tell me you actually think that DRM make windows better)
-Super customizable
-Great for programmers
-A large fun community
-Easier to fix if you know what you're doing
-Super portable
-Often very compatible
-etc

And for business desktops, I know for a fact that Home Depot switched all there cash registers to Linux a few years ago because they could customize it better to there networks. I know others of done similar

xShadow · « **Reply #217 on:** February 17, 2009, 08:29:08 PM »

Quote from: dankles on February 17, 2009, 08:12:41 PM

Quote from: xShadow on February 17, 2009, 08:02:16 PM
But fine, I'll give you your point: Linux can be used successfully in a business environment. Fine... but I'm still failing to see how it's "better" at it. Most of your posts involved saying something to the extent of "Linux kicks Windows' ass at everything." I'm fine with saying that it can do most things that Windows can, but you saying that it's "better" is quite a stretch.
We agree in opposites, because I don't understand why Windows has to be "better" lol
Why I call linux "better" is for many reasons:
-Biggest reason is I just plain like it
-no drm (don't tell me you actually think that DRM make windows better)
-Super customizable
-Great for programmers
-A large fun community
-Easier to fix if you know what you're doing
-Super portable
-Often very compatible
-etc

And for business desktops, I know for a fact that Home Depot switched all there cash registers to Linux a few years ago because they could customize it better to there networks. I know others of done similar

Again, I was never trying to make the point that "Windows is Better". The only thing I'm saying is that it just isn't as appealing an option for your average consumer (and, most of all, your average videogamer; with a lovely slew of driver support problem and games that can't be played on it, I just can't see it as being very appealing), be it business or not; I was stating that at the moment it doesn't have much of a chance of actually competing with Windows. Moreover, I trying to put an end to your damned incessant fanboying (yes, I made a new noun), about how Linux was "better". I think you misunderstood this with me trying to say that Windows was better. As long as you understand (and agree) that Linux is not "Objectively" (<<< READ) better than Windows, then my job here is done.

Quote

-no drm (don't tell me you actually think that DRM make windows better)

It may not make it better, but I have so far failed to see how it makes it worse. It makes it better (maybe) because I can play DRM content, if I want to. It won't even open normally. However, this is all respective to exactly how damned paranoid you are... (even the "Google" example you had up was umm... trivial, at least to me...)

Quote

And for business desktops, I know for a fact that Home Depot switched all there cash registers to Linux a few years ago because they could customize it better to there networks. I know others of done similar

That's cash registers. I mean actual, in-office use. How many businesses switched (and are still staying with it) for word processing and whatnot?

Undermining your personal reasons for using Linux was, on the other hand, never my intention. I don't care if you "like" it better, and give reasons for why you think it's better, but just outright denouncing Windows as shit just because of your subjective reasons is retarded.

dankles · « **Reply #218 on:** February 17, 2009, 08:55:43 PM »

I think we should just agree to disagree... hehe

In other light: I looked at your anidb list and it looks like we would agree on *alot* of shows.

furuoshiki · « **Reply #219 on:** February 17, 2009, 10:01:10 PM »

Quote from: Dragoon AceHigh on February 17, 2009, 07:07:45 PM

By expressing your opinions you reveal things about yourself, the more you do them more I know about you.

Wrong!

This is why eDating doesn't work.

You can NEVER know anything significant about a person through the internet.

That being said...Windows 7 messing around with DRM is a dumb idea and will further cause Microsoft to lose out to Linux or Mac. Everyone is seeing how the behemoth is now shedding it's scales and becoming weaker as bill hands over the reigns to someone else. By the time I am 70...Microsoft will be no more.

DRM is more of a threat than you people seem to be willing to admit. It is not DRM itself but the capabilities of surveillance technologies which it is based upon which is the object of concern.

Both Jobs and Gates are showing the signs of aging and they are tired. If a new jack doesn't step up to the plate you can forget about either of these companies lasting until 2020 the way the economy is going today.

I've tested out Windows 7 through a friend who works for Microsoft...and it isn't all that great. And since not everyone is a software engineer, Linux will not grow significantly in popularity even in the event of yet ANOTHER Microsoft OS failure. People will hibernate again...and go back to XP. Especially small businesses and corporate industries which rely on stable and simple platforms.

Microsoft may be gay but it's the only thing we've got. Mac typically doesn't appeal to anyone but Artists, Musicians and Hipsters...and it's too expensive (overpriced and overvalued with "premiums") and the hardware doesn't last long enough. (Not that I'm saying Dell is any better...) Linux cannot be used casually or professionally because it is also gay and once something goes wrong and you are not a programmer you are fucked and so are you files.

Windows is the cheap and easy solution and this is why everyone picks it. Windows 7 won't do that well but it's not like we have a choice, after all this is a bona fide government condoned monopoly in case you've all forgotten.