Author Topic: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs  (Read 2777 times)

sarreq

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Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« on: April 06, 2009, 09:48:16 AM »
If no one else is doing it (I've not seen anyone else claim they're up to it), I've started to put together the Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs. I'm using the official DVDISOs as source, compressing myself, but using a mix (I mean frappéd  in a blender, not each one for a different episode) of Himatsubushi and SebDESU scripts with heavy repair by myself. I'm just about done the first episode if anyone wants to judge.

screenies


sarreq

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2009, 10:09:43 AM »
I'll apologize right now if I've posted this in the wrong forum, I really wasn't sure where to do so.

Offline Blanchimont

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2009, 12:18:45 PM »
It would help the comparison if you had the equivalent images from the dvd/vob to compare to...
And images don't tell the story of possible interlacing/combing/framerate/color issues etc, only way to check those would be to actually view an episode...
With the scripts you mean avisynth scripts?

"..It's our dreams that guide us towards the future...not force"

sarreq

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2009, 05:59:37 AM »
No, scripts as in subtitles

I was planning on uploading ep1 to megaupload and posting the link for anyone to check out, I'm still working out some final bits though, most likely by tomorrow

as for comparison screenshots, I hadn't thought to keep the DVDs after I figured out settings to give me results I'm satisfied with, so that'll have to wait until I have the 4th DVD downloaded and transcoded

update: worked out, should be uploaded in about an hour
« Last Edit: April 07, 2009, 06:13:23 AM by sarreq »

sarreq

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2009, 07:26:33 AM »
done
I can handle the flak, do yer worst (don't hurt me)

one more thing, I'm trying to play with the sandbox, but I'm not sure if I'm getting the screenshot bbcode right, do I nest all the links within one [screenshot] [/screenshot] hierarchy, or do I use a new hierarchy for each screenshot. either way it doesn't seem to want to preview while I'm in the sandbox
« Last Edit: April 07, 2009, 10:08:51 AM by sarreq »

Offline Southrop

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2009, 11:45:46 AM »
Code: [Select]
[screenshot]
[url=(IMAGE_URL_HERE)][IMG](THUMBNAIL_URL_HERE)[/IMG][/URL]
etc.
[/screenshot]

Though I'm told that we no longer need to use the thumbnail URL.

sarreq

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2009, 01:06:55 PM »
that's what I was going by, but it doesn't seem to want to preview at all. here's what I've tried

Code: [Select]
[screenshot]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen1.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen1tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen1b.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen1btb.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen2.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen2tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen3.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen3tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen4.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen4tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen5.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen5tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen6.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen6tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[/screenshot]

or

[screenshot]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen1.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen1tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[/screenshot]
[screenshot]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen1b.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen1btb.jpg[/img][/url]
[/screenshot]
[screenshot]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen2.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen2tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[/screenshot]
[screenshot]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen3.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen3tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[/screenshot]
[screenshot]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen4.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen4tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[/screenshot]
[screenshot]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen5.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen5tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[/screenshot]
[screenshot]
[url=http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen6.jpg][img]http://sarreq.elflord.net/images/forbox/WAsshoi!%20screen6tb.jpg[/img][/url]
[/screenshot]

both with and without the img tags, with and without the punycode

Offline Southrop

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2009, 01:28:00 PM »
Ah. The sandbox still can't display the screenshot tag properly, if that's what you meant. But the correct usage is the first one.

sarreq

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2009, 04:53:16 PM »
yerkyderky, thanks. that's what I was thinking.


anyone have any critiques on that episode though?

Offline Blanchimont

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2009, 07:06:46 PM »
yerkyderky, thanks. that's what I was thinking.


anyone have any critiques on that episode though?
I finally had time to take a look at it...

No interlacing/combing I could notice, nor any obvious 'hacking' despite being entirely cfr so it was decimated correctly :)...
Quote
# timecode format v1
Assume 29.970030
0,36221,23.976017

Encoder settings are fine (from MediaInfo);
Quote
cabac=1 / ref=5 / deblock=1:1:1 / analyse=0x3:0x133 / me=tesa / subme=9 / psy_rd=1.0:0.0 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=2 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=1 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / mbaff=0 / bframes=8 / b_pyramid=1 / b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / wpredb=1 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40 / rc=2pass / bitrate=979 / ratetol=1.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / vbv_maxrate=50000 / vbv_bufsize=50000 / ip_ratio=1.40 / pb_ratio=1.30 / aq=1:1.00
...very good encoder settings (I assume it's at least two-pass as some of the settings would not make any sense for single-pass), in comparison here's mine for Risky&Safety(v2);
Quote
cabac=1 / ref=16 / deblock=1:-2:-2 / analyse=0x3:0x133 / me=tesa / subme=9 / psy_rd=1.0:0.0 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=32 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=2 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=1 / nr=0 / decimate=0 / mbaff=0 / bframes=6 / b_pyramid=1 / b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=3 / wpredb=1 / keyint=250 / keyint_min=25 / scenecut=40 / rc=2pass / bitrate=2229 / ratetol=1.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / cplxblur=20.0 / qblur=0.5 / ip_ratio=1.40 / pb_ratio=1.30 / aq=1:1.00

But is the image supposed to be so blurry? Or was the source like that? Deinterlacing applied to all frames, along with low deblocking threshold, could produce extensive blurring. Deinterlacing all frames does have the benefit of removing residual interlacing, apparent for example when characters are speaking, but I personally dislike it for the sacrifice of all the good frames...
You could try a deblocking of 1:0:0, perhaps lower dependant of the source (don't go as low as me though (-2,-2), I'm using slight antialiasing filter to counter the ant crawling caused by those settings, but prefer it as it retains very high level of detail, especially by the fact it's countered by the slight sharpening caused for some reason by Telecide/Decimate (don't know the reason for that, but it's the source as I did comparison encodes with TFM/TDecimate...))

Also, you could opt not to deinterlace all frames, if that is indeed set to true in your encoder/avs...
This is in comparison from my script;
Quote
Telecide(order=1,guide=0,vthresh=40,dthresh=5,blend=true,ovr="frames.ovr")
Decimate(mode=4,threshold=1.0,timecodes="timecodes.txt",vfrstats="vfrstats")
Set the threshold according to your source, you might need to lower the threshold to deal with things, like characters mouths mentioned above (lower threshold=more bad frames catched but more good frames deinterlaced) or use an overrides file to deal with the bad frames it misses. It's still better than deinterlacing all frames in my opinion...

As for the bitrate difference, that is just because yours is cfr and I used Decimate mode 4, and on top of that DeDup, dropping the number of frames for an average episode from ~18000 to ~12000 thus leaving more bitrate per frame. Nothing to worry about as a high-action encode as Macademi benefits far less from vfr than a very static type of animation like Risky&Safety...

A lot of the settings above can be done in the encoder instead of the avs script, so what application did you use for the dvds/dvd-images? Handbrake, Megui, other?

Subs experience short lead-out times, but that's hard to remedy without extensive work in Aegisub. + for including the fonts :) (which sometimes are forgotten) and the chapters...

Other than the blurring (which of course could be because of the source) I give you thumbs up for the encode :)...
« Last Edit: April 07, 2009, 08:25:35 PM by Blanchimont »

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sarreq

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2009, 08:39:56 PM »
@Blanchimont:

thank you muchly

the interlacing on this was especially difficult for some reason, I finally came up with weaving to 59.976fps then decimating to 23.976 (though I'm still not entirely sure why it came out 29.976 instead ??? ). how do I do vfr, I'd like to see if it works better.

I've been looking over them again while working on the subs, so I have noticed some blurriness, more so when using CoreAVC to decode than with FFDShow, though. But I do think I'm going to re-encode them.

From DVD to a usable very high bitrate intermediate file (original framerate & interlacing, no filtering) I used DVDFab5. From the intermediate to the output (pre-muxing) I'm using RipBot264 with a custom profile meant for compatibility with my popcorn hour. for some odd reason ripbot doesn't like the linear pcm in the DVDs

----I just had a thought, it's possible I could set FFDShow to deinterlace (Ripbot uses it for decoding), 5tap lowpass seems to get good results

Offline Blanchimont

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2009, 09:03:38 PM »
@Blanchimont:
the interlacing on this was especially difficult for some reason, I finally came up with weaving to 59.976fps then decimating to 23.976 (though I'm still not entirely sure why it came out 29.976 instead ??? ). how do I do vfr, I'd like to see if it works better.
It IS 23.976 (2400/1001) :)
Quote
# timecode format v1
Assume 29.970030
0,36221,23.976017
As for the rest, vfr and dvd transfer, check your pm soon...

Edit; I send a guide, just don't ask how compatible vfr is with popcorn hour, or with the settings used in the guide :-\...
« Last Edit: April 07, 2009, 10:34:58 PM by Blanchimont »

"..It's our dreams that guide us towards the future...not force"

sarreq

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2009, 10:46:20 PM »
thanks for the guide, I'll see if I can get Megui to actually work for me (it generally refuses to) and try that out
the PH has no problem with VFR, or none with the VFR series I've played on it so far, anyway ;D

Quote
It IS 23.976 (2400/1001)
sorry, I misread that the first time ::)

Offline AceD

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2009, 05:26:52 AM »
well id appreciate some dvd rips of that, its one of the best comedy animes imo

sarreq

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2009, 03:36:49 PM »
OK, here's an odd question, one that will affect certain aspects of my version's subtitle, but odd anyway. is there some version of MPC-HC I'm not aware of where ASS animation and kara transforms actually work on playback?? I see subbers trying to use both, but I've never actually seen it work except in Aegisub's preview window.

edit: OK, so FFDShow-tryouts does it, that's not immediately obvious to your average viewer. since most groups I've seen recommend CCCP, should I assume that it's automatically setup that way?
« Last Edit: April 08, 2009, 03:47:32 PM by sarreq »

Offline Blanchimont

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2009, 06:53:57 PM »
Where did you find the discs images, or did you have the actual discs? :)
I'm tempted to encode an episode of it, just to get a gist of what we're dealing with, but can't find any source material to experiment on...

Exactly what kind of troubles are you having with megui? I might be able to help. (At least with xp under the hood, Vista on the other hand is pretty much unknown territory to me :-\...)

"..It's our dreams that guide us towards the future...not force"

sarreq

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #16 on: April 08, 2009, 08:10:07 PM »
I found torrents of the first 3 through isohunt, I'm still waiting on a torrent of disk 4, and 5 & 6 won't be released until the end of april and may (respectively), so if all else goes well, I'll be releasing a batch probably by the second week of june (and singles as I finish them, through nyaa probably)

Megui. I install it, load a file, pick my settings, hit start encoding, and all I get back is an error message. doesn't matter what kind of source I try using, just won't work. It's been a year since I last tried though, maybe that's been sorted out since then, I just haven't gotten around to trying yet. I was using vista at the time, but everything it uses (what I'm sure it uses, anyway) works under vista just fine. I've since jumped into 7, and have had no compatibility hiccups, except with a couple device drivers, but that's only because of my now ancient nforce3 mobo, which hasn't caused an troubles anyway. oddly enough, I've been able to run a couple programs which wouldn't work under vista, so it's probably time to try megui again.

edit: just found disk 4, but there's only 1 seed on it  :-\
« Last Edit: April 08, 2009, 08:27:19 PM by sarreq »

Offline Blanchimont

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #17 on: April 08, 2009, 09:13:08 PM »
You ARE loading the source(video) through an .avs file?(avisynth script, a textfile containing the script, but with .avs instead .txt) (with either Directshowsource, avisource, Mpeg2source etc?). And you have Avisynth installed?. Because if not, it won't work...

If it's not one of the above, try encoding only the video, and leave audio be, audio can be handled separately if needed, and audio is more prone to errors in megui, at least in my experience...

"..It's our dreams that guide us towards the future...not force"

sarreq

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #18 on: May 06, 2009, 06:55:41 AM »
sorry for not replying in a while, I've been otherwise busy or sick.

apparently, according to the Aegisub developers, FFDShow's subtitle filter is more broken than I've noticed (I've not run into any of their gripes), does anyone know of an up to date build of vsfilter (other than the on in MPC-HC, it's more broken) or something equivalent?

@Blanchimont: megui ONLY allows you to load an avs script, so, yes

Offline Southrop

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Re: Macademi WAsshoi! DVDs
« Reply #19 on: May 06, 2009, 07:52:33 AM »
If you haven't noticed already, DmonHiro and Loli-pop Subs are both encoding this show now. I think DmonHiro's ones will probably get upped here.