Americans Split on Health Coverage, Obama down in Polls

[Jski]

The simple true is that America is becoming a underdeveloped country due to our old idealizes. What may of worked 40 years ago may not work now. Something will have to be done or a lot of pepole will get sick or even die just because they do not have the money to live. That is how our system works if you do not have money you do not live. Is it a good thing that money is life? (You know i find it odd to see this must agned such a thing you would think watching anime would put people here in the mind set that you have to help others because most anime is like that. I guess the help the week is lost some where when going from reading book, watching anime or playing video games is not getting though to people.)

[relic2279]

but this socialism is unacceptable.

Seems you listen to too much glenn beck, fox news, rush, pick your idiocy. Single payer health care which is what is being proposed is in no way even remotely tied to socialism. It's either that, or you don't understand the definition of the word. It's moronic propaganda. And you fell for it.

I'm not against authority, but I'm against the liberties that are being taken by Obama and his administration.

Are you even remotely aware of the liberties that were removed from you by the GOP from 2001-2008? I mean, It's like you're complaining about a splinter when you just got your leg shot off. Oh. But those were good christian conservatives who did it, so it's ok...  

As much crap as Bush did, this is from bad to worse.

Not even close. I'm actually stunned you feel that way.  I'm no Obama lover, but I can't stand non-critical thinkers. If you actually believe Bush is a better president and things are worse under obama, you are not a critical thinker.

Wiretapping is nothing compared to the government taking control of pretty much every aspect of your life. which is what he intends to do.

After this sentence I had to skip the rest of the paragraph. If you actually believe this, I feel sorry for you.

As soon as you log on, your computer becomes federal property. It seems hard to go wrong with that sort of wording.

Did you even read the link you posted? It claimed what you are saying is completely false. O_o

Stop getting your info from aol chain letters, fox news, your mom who listens to rush and think for yourself. That's the only advice I can give someone.

[queenmetroid]

Seems you listen to too much glenn beck, fox news, rush, pick your idiocy. Single payer health care which is what is being proposed is in no way even remotely tied to socialism. It's either that, or you don't understand the definition of the word. It's moronic propaganda. And you fell for it.

Socialism, economic and social system under which essential industries and social services are publicly and cooperatively owned and democratically controlled with a view to equal opportunity and equal benefit for all. The term socialism also refers to the doctrine behind this system and the political movement inspired by it.

Nice ad hominem, it makes you look like the idiot, not me. I'll ignore it and show you where you are wrong. So, national healthcare = everything is owned by the government (e.g. publicly, but not really) and there is equal care for all. Hmmm. Could be wrong but I think that's what the above definition is. A national healthcare plan is nothing but socialism dressed up. 

I'm not against authority, but I'm against the liberties that are being taken by Obama and his administration.

Are you even remotely aware of the liberties that were removed from you by the GOP from 2001-2008? I mean, It's like you're complaining about a splinter when you just got your leg shot off. Oh. But those were good christian conservatives who did it, so it's ok...  

As much crap as Bush did, this is from bad to worse.

Not even close. I'm actually stunned you feel that way.  I'm no Obama lover, but I can't stand non-critical thinkers. If you actually believe Bush is a better president and things are worse under obama, you are not a critical thinker.

Wiretapping is nothing compared to the government taking control of pretty much every aspect of your life. which is what he intends to do.

After this sentence I had to skip the rest of the paragraph. If you actually believe this, I feel sorry for you.

Again, another fail ad hominem attack. Instead of telling me why I was wrong, you (One) implied that I'm a Christian, (Two) implied that I'm an idiot, and (Three) that I even liked or voted for Bush. Protip: I didn't vote for Bush or Obama. I didn't even vote for McCain. I'm pro-constitution, unlike everyone in this hellhole of government.
Again, think about it. Have you heard what Obama wants to do? He wants to censor video games (Boo!), try and shut up people who don't like him, strong arm Congress into going against the will of the American people and do who knows what else. The words come from the man's own mouth! Do you listen to half of what he says?

As soon as you log on, your computer becomes federal property. It seems hard to go wrong with that sort of wording.

Did you even read the link you posted? It claimed what you are saying is completely false. O_o

Stop getting your info from aol chain letters, fox news, your mom who listens to rush and think for yourself. That's the only advice I can give someone.

Again, read and pay attention. I'm not interested in the fact of where it was, but what it said. It was blown way out of proportion no doubt, but the fact remains I'm a little concerned when a government website tells me I lose all my rights by entering. When the terms and conditions say that you give ownership of your computer by logging into a website, shouldn't you be paying attention? As if SecuROM wasn't bad enough being on my damn computer.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/On-Cookies/
http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Facts-Are-Stubborn-Things/

So, change the rules about third party privacy on government websites? Won't that affect privacy? Of course not! That and national insurance won't cost me a dime extra. I'm sick of the lies coming from up top.

Anyway, it's too bad your mother didn't teach you any better manners when it comes to arguing. I guess that's life.

[vicious796]

Relic, you tend to start up every post about how you're not an Obama lover, maybe it's time you came out of the closet. Yes, we know you're so liberal that he's too far right for you, great. What you are, though, is an Obama supporter.

The President is only as good as his approval ratings are, this isn't like football (WOOT LESS THAN A MONTH) where you have so many statistics you can convince someone that an 8-8 team was one of the best in the league, just had some bad moments/injuries. Right now, Obama's barely staying above the 50% margin, a 20% decline in less than a year. Less than half of the polled populace think the healthcare plan is a good one.

Enough so that there are protests, some violent, at town hall meetings about the subject. However, Sen. Arlen Specter, tells us that "it's not a representive of the US people".

source: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090812/ap_on_go_co/us_health_care_protests

However, I'm sure he'd tell you that the protests at the RNC were, also all the Bush protests in his tenure. What about the polls? What about that 20% drop in less than a year? Nothing to worry about, I'm told, it's just a flux. It probably isn't a real representation of the American people, though Bush's were MOST DEFINATELY accurate.

Look, I'm not saying this is the worst America has ever been, but Obama is no savior. Are people eating up the negative propoganda about this Health-Care Reform? Sure, I'll give you that. But, in turn, I want you to admit you ate up every word about "Change" from this, so far, very par for the course democrat. Tax and spend, tax and spend, spend, spend.

Obama will go down in history as the first African-American President of the United States, nothing more. He isn't Hitler, he isn't Reagan, he isn't Nixon. He's like Jimmy Carter, one term wonder, at least right now.

[relic2279]

Socialism, economic and social system under which essential industries and social services are publicly and cooperatively owned and democratically controlled with a view to equal opportunity and equal benefit for all. The term socialism also refers to the doctrine behind this system and the political movement inspired by it.

Nice ad hominem, it makes you look like the idiot, not me. I'll ignore it and show you where you are wrong. So, national healthcare = everything is owned by the government

I'm not showing you where you were wrong because it's not my job to educate you. There were so many fallacies in your last post, I could write a dissertation on it. You are the one making claims. It's your job to back them up. If I claim the sky is red, it's my job to prove it. Burden of proof.

Anyhow, lets start with this. Yes, I know what socialism is. I asked, "how is single payer healthcare, socialism?" The government DOES NOT control healthcare under that plan. So exactly how is it socialism?

http://open.salon.com/blog/je_robertson/2009/06/19/the_public_option_is_not_socialized_medicine

Again, another fail ad hominem attack. Instead of telling me why I was wrong, you (One) implied that I'm a Christian, (Two) implied that I'm an idiot, and (Three) that I even liked or voted for Bush. Protip: I didn't vote for Bush or Obama. I didn't even vote for McCain. I'm pro-constitution, unlike everyone in this hellhole of government.

I never said or implied any of those things.

You said things are worse under Obama, than Bush. Didn't say you liked bush, only that you believe obama is worse then bush. And I said since "Christian conservatives did it, it's ok", I was poking fun at the social conservatives, like palin, bush and mike huckabee, not you. You seem to like putting words in my mouth, it's either that, or you are misreading my posts.

Again, think about it. Have you heard what Obama wants to do? He wants to censor video games (Boo!), try and shut up people who don't like him, strong arm Congress into going against the will of the American people and do who knows what else. The words come from the man's own mouth! Do you listen to half of what he says?
Anyway, it's too bad your mother didn't teach you any better manners when it comes to arguing. I guess that's life.

Have a source? You make outrageous claims like this and expect me to take you seriously. I'm not trying to be mean, I'm only trying to stop misinformation before it begins. Your above claims are either outright lies or severely twisted distortions of truth.

Relic, you tend to start up every post about how you're not an Obama lover, maybe it's time you came out of the closet. Yes, we know you're so liberal that he's too far right for you, great. What you are, though, is an Obama supporter.

When you have people like queenmetroid just spewing outright misinformation and lies, and I have to correct them every day, it probably does seem like I'm an Obama supporter. (By the way, did you read her/his last post above yours? At least with you, we can have a somewhat decent debate based on facts)

source: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090812/ap_on_go_co/us_health_care_protests

Ah, you mean those fake riots? Here is Rachel Maddow proving it:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/vp/32277121#32277121

And here is a bunch of links with various "Busted" type stories on how most if not all of were fabricated:
http://www.reddit.com/search?q=GOP+town+hall&sort=top

Obama is no savoir
I want you to admit you ate up every word about "Change" from this, so far, very par for the course democrat.

Oh I don't disagree. Where IS my change..   He hasn't done much. It's still semi-early, I still have a wait and see attitude. His actions so far have been... meh... mediocre at best.

[vicious796]

What's not being brought up are the real ones that aren't being reported. There was a town-hall like meeting a week or so ago in Manassas, VA (next to where I work) that turned rather ugly quickly, sending a couple to the hospital. Only reason I knew about it was because a friend of mine was there. Nothing in the news, no reported arrests in the newspapers, nothing. Now, Steve isn't the most honest person in the world but he is rather political. He's an Obama supporter though, so I don't see what he gains by talking about "those stupid rednecks starting shit at the convention".

[Semnae]

Dictating who should live and die based on their health, is a Hitler thing.  

And where is that in the bill?  Grandstanding much?

That is the truth and everyone knows it. Look at Canada. The much lauded system has obscene wait times. Basically, what will happen is that the federal govenment will deny you care if you are over a certain age. They have to, because they cannot afford to pay for everyone. That's the way it is in Britain. If you are over a certain age, you don't get care. Simple as that. There's too many old people here for us young people to support. Under his plan, I will be taxed to nothing. Obama is on crack (read: lying through his teeth) when he says that everyone will get taken care of. The federal government will fail at a healthcare system. Plain and simple.

I think your forgetting one very important fact.  Politicians have to be elected.  Voters aren't going to vote for officials that kill off their grand parents.  What your suggesting is political suicide, and couldn't happen in any democratic nation.

[DrmChsr0]

I dunno what the big hoohaa is all about when it comes to this healthcare reform, but isn't Obama basically giving every American a healthcare insurance plan that basically pays for your trips to the doctors?

I mean, the only other system that isn't the NHS is Medishield, and that is a Singaporean healthcare policy that gives everyone in Singapore enough money to pay for their doctor's bills.

(Yes, it's the same country that thought up taxing people who drive cars on a daily basis to ease traffic flow. I got my own issues with my own country, but this isn't one of them.)

And the Republicans are saying he's gonna force the future generation of Americans into debt because of this? What the derp? Where were they when Bush Jnr. gave America at least $27 trillion (the actual number is somewhere close to $53 trillion and counting.) in debt? Where the the Republicans when Nixon, Bush Snr, and Reagan thought it was cool to lend from other countries? What was the need for that Alaskan Bridge to nowhere?

[relic2279]

I dunno what the big hoohaa is all about when it comes to this healthcare reform, but isn't Obama basically giving every American a healthcare insurance plan that basically pays for your trips to the doctors?

Nah, that would be evil socialism... 
Single payer isn't national health care, or even universal health care. Single payer gives the "option" to have health care at an affordable rate. You can still keep the shitty plan your employers offer you, till they drop you once something serious happens or won't cover pre-existing conditions after something does happen to you. In which case, you die, go bankrupt or ... sign up for the single payer plan.

Speaking of insurance,

Seems Glenn Beck's lunacy is too much even for his own sponsers:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/james-rucker/geico-pulls-its-ads-from_b_256724.html

Geico pulled it's ads from his show and "Lawyers.com, Progressive Insurance, Procter & Gamble, and SC Johnson -- also distanced themselves from Beck."

[vicious796]

It's not all about the socialism aspect, it's got alot to do with the debt we have, the debt we're still building, and the debt that will have to increase to pay for this.

Did Obama create our entire debt? Of course not. What was the first thing he started doing upon getting in office? Spend. Spend a shit ton. Not even on healthcare, that's going to be MORE money, but on everything else. A huge, bloated Omnibus bill. A large car trade-in bill. The continuation of that same car bill.

Not saying Cash for Clunkers is bad, just that it's expensive. Just because someone else did it already doesn't make it the right thing to do - building up debt that is. You can't justify Obama's spending by saying "well Bush did such and such", that doesn't make it right. I've been saying this for what seems like forever but has only been a few short months. Two wrongs don't make a right, spending 2 trillion dollars doesn't give you 5 trillion - it just makes you lose 2 trillion.

On top of that, there's so much questionable material in the bill itself. I ask you, have you read it? Do you know what's in it? What do you think a "competitive" fee is? These are the same people who thought offices paying more than 150k in salaries had to be large offices - they're way off base. Everything they do is seperate from reality and they don't understand what it's like to be one of their constituents.

There are protests going on around the country in the town-hall meetings that have become so popular. Have some of them been blown out of proportion? Yes. Does that take away from the fact that people are not happy with this bill right now? No.

"Well nobody said anything in Obama's town hall!" No shit. What do you think the security was like there? How difficult do you think it was to get into the place in the first place? It wasn't a rinky dink Senator talking to their constituents, that was the President of the United States. Secret Service was all the fuck over that building, no riot is taking place.

So stop with this "Well Bush did..." or "Well the Republicans did..." bull shit because it doesn't justify the Democrats actions. We're not in middle-school, this tit-for-tat shit doesn't fly in the real world.

[Jski]

So what does high debt mean event? People keep talking about it but only use as if it was the bogeyman don't turn your back or the debt will get you. Its comply unrealistic to think a normal person to be debt free why cant we apply that to country and in a way its good to be in debt to other country it crates a suasion where the country become depend on each other there by making them work together and hopefully letting them over all make more wealth and grow.
On another note the most valuable thing we have in the USA is the people and not the random goods that we produces. So it would be economical good to invest in the people more then any thing else.

[vicious796]

So what does high debt mean event? People keep talking about it but only use as if it was the bogeyman don't turn your back or the debt will get you. Its comply unrealistic to think a normal person to be debt free why cant we apply that to country and in a way its good to be in debt to other country it crates a suasion where the country become depend on each other there by making them work together and hopefully letting them over all make more wealth and grow.
On another note the most valuable thing we have in the USA is the people and not the random goods that we produces. So it would be economical good to invest in the people more then any thing else.

Because there is a point where people stop lending you money, both as individuals and as a country. There's a collapsing point to an economy when your debt to income ratio is unfixable and if the US economy crashes (literally) so goes the economy of everyone else. Money is, in fact, a very real thing and it's something we're bleeding already. If you force too much regulation and tax on the upper class and businesses (one in the same mostly) you will see what we've already seen:

They will leave the country. With them go the jobs they created and the taxes you could have applied to them.

Without those jobs your unemployment rate skyrockets. With that comes a larger burden on the working class' taxes. This leads to deterioration of morale as well as state budgets.

Do you see the cycle?

[Semnae]

Consider this.  I'm up to my neck in personal debt.  This debt was accumulated primarily through loans I needed to pay for my college education.  Once I'm done with college, I will be in a better position to pay off my loans.  Once I'm done paying off my debt, I will be better off than I was initially.  This is called making an investment.  Nations work on the same investment principle.  We are spending a lot and accumulating debt now, but this spending will strengthen the economy so that we will be in a better position to repay that debt later.

Now tie this into health care.  It's going to be expensive, but not only will almost everyone be covered, it's going to help the economy immensely.  Covering all the previously uninsured will cause the insurance industry to boom.  On top of that, there's going to be a new demand for doctors and other medical professionals to treat all these newly insured individuals.  As demand increases, colleges profit as new people get educated to fill that demand.  Better colleges and more educated people leads to more advances in technology, and we regain the lead in technology.  These advances need manufacturers and distributors.  You get the idea.  Over all, the benefit to our economy far outweighs the debt we will gain.

[Jski]

So what does high debt mean event? People keep talking about it but only use as if it was the bogeyman don't turn your back or the debt will get you. Its comply unrealistic to think a normal person to be debt free why cant we apply that to country and in a way its good to be in debt to other country it crates a suasion where the country become depend on each other there by making them work together and hopefully letting them over all make more wealth and grow.
On another note the most valuable thing we have in the USA is the people and not the random goods that we produces. So it would be economical good to invest in the people more then any thing else.

Because there is a point where people stop lending you money, both as individuals and as a country. There's a collapsing point to an economy when your debt to income ratio is unfixable and if the US economy crashes (literally) so goes the economy of everyone else. Money is, in fact, a very real thing and it's something we're bleeding already. If you force too much regulation and tax on the upper class and businesses (one in the same mostly) you will see what we've already seen:

They will leave the country. With them go the jobs they created and the taxes you could have applied to them.

Without those jobs your unemployment rate skyrockets. With that comes a larger burden on the working class' taxes. This leads to deterioration of morale as well as state budgets.

Do you see the cycle?

Well that seems to be the same argument for the "race to the bottom" where businesses will move to where there are less regulations but this is not what going on just some businesses have moved but most have stayed in place. This argument seems more of a scare tactic then any thing else. This argument is used to go vs. worker rights too.

[nates1984]

Secondly, our schools are shit because republicans fight reform in that area, at least since Reagan. Probably a reason most in the academic market are democrats. Bush's 'no child left behind' solution was a real win. I personally think all education should be free or socialized including higher education.

Wrong. Schools are shit because of underpaid teachers and uninvolved parents.

lrn2think

You can't just blame everything on a political party, and you can't expect your government to take care of you cradle to grave.

On health care: Considering the shitty condition our schools, highways, ect. are in, I don't trust the government to run the health care system. Reform should start with the way our government operates, only after that can we talk health care. Essentially this whole discussion is moot for this reason.

[DrmChsr0]

Not saying Cash for Clunkers is bad, just that it's expensive. Just because someone else did it already doesn't make it the right thing to do - building up debt that is. You can't justify Obama's spending by saying "well Bush did such and such", that doesn't make it right. I've been saying this for what seems like forever but has only been a few short months. Two wrongs don't make a right, spending 2 trillion dollars doesn't give you 5 trillion - it just makes you lose 2 trillion.

On top of that, there's so much questionable material in the bill itself. I ask you, have you read it? Do you know what's in it? What do you think a "competitive" fee is? These are the same people who thought offices paying more than 150k in salaries had to be large offices - they're way off base. Everything they do is seperate from reality and they don't understand what it's like to be one of their constituents.

There are protests going on around the country in the town-hall meetings that have become so popular. Have some of them been blown out of proportion? Yes. Does that take away from the fact that people are not happy with this bill right now? No.

"Well nobody said anything in Obama's town hall!" No shit. What do you think the security was like there? How difficult do you think it was to get into the place in the first place? It wasn't a rinky dink Senator talking to their constituents, that was the President of the United States. Secret Service was all the fuck over that building, no riot is taking place.

So stop with this "Well Bush did..." or "Well the Republicans did..." bull shit because it doesn't justify the Democrats actions. We're not in middle-school, this tit-for-tat shit doesn't fly in the real world.

I wasn't actually referring about what Bush did, if I read your comment correctly. I was referring to the protesting that's going on because of Obama increasing the debt. Since they didn't protest Reaganomics, the War On Terror, and the deregulation of the global economy...

Their protesting sees to be extremely hypocritical and offensive. And this isn't about the whole evil socialism aspect (and yes, Singapore does seem to be an evil socialist nation, but it's actually a corporation.) they're pushing, since that's immediately offensive to almost everyone due to all that Hitler they managed to infuse it with.

I don't like debt myself (How to reduce your debt tip: Swap your credit cards for debit cards. Or better still, do without either.), and I think Obama may be wrong to increase the debt, but he's giving a lot of people a shot at affordable healthcare. Healthy people work longer and better and spend more money.

Dunno about the debt, though. Personally, I'm into taxing the crap outta the corporations, since they are the ones with the money, but there be problems if the taxation isn't implemented globally.

[Sosseres]

Dunno about the debt, though. Personally, I'm into taxing the crap outta the corporations, since they are the ones with the money, but there be problems if the taxation isn't implemented globally.

It can't be implemented globally since countries want to attract/keep companies and no single country can force all other countries. If we had a global government that might work, but we don't have anything near that.

(I also agree on the credit card part, not being able to go into debt on them is a nice way not to go into it. Though most peoples debt doesn't come from that but from cars, houses and things like that.)

[bcr123]

Dunno about the debt, though. Personally, I'm into taxing the crap outta the corporations, since they are the ones with the money, but there be problems if the taxation isn't implemented globally.

It can't be implemented globally since countries want to attract/keep companies and no single country can force all other countries. If we had a global government that might work, but we don't have anything near that.

(I also agree on the credit card part, not being able to go into debt on them is a nice way not to go into it. Though most peoples debt doesn't come from that but from cars, houses and things like that.)

About 40% of consumer debt is on credit cards (1 trillion of 2.5 trillion total)

"Consumer debt in June dropped nearly 5 percent to $2.5 trillion."
"Americans still have nearly $1 trillion on their credit cards ($917 billion). "

( http://voices.washingtonpost.com/economy-watch/2009/08/consumers_continue_to_cut_debt.html?hpid=sec-business )

[Sosseres]

•Homes.  U.S. consumers had $6.8 trillion in mortgage debt, accounting for nearly three-quarters of their total debt at the end of 2003. http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/general/2004-03-17-debtcover_x.htm

http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/SavingandDebt/P70741.asp has generally the same figures but doesn't state totals.

I honestly think I was right, even if these figures are a few years old. That they can cash in their houses is of course an option for these things in many cases. In some the debt they have is higher than the house price and it will get worse as people start losing their houses and the amount of buyers stays roughly the same. Unless investors buy them for the future and rent them out in the meantime.
http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article8126.html (Source for people soon to lose their homes.)

[Natheria]

Consider this.  I'm up to my neck in personal debt.  This debt was accumulated primarily through loans I needed to pay for my college education.  Once I'm done with college, I will be in a better position to pay off my loans.  Once I'm done paying off my debt, I will be better off than I was initially.  This is called making an investment.  Nations work on the same investment principle.  We are spending a lot and accumulating debt now, but this spending will strengthen the economy so that we will be in a better position to repay that debt later.

Now tie this into health care.  It's going to be expensive, but not only will almost everyone be covered, it's going to help the economy immensely.  Covering all the previously uninsured will cause the insurance industry to boom.  On top of that, there's going to be a new demand for doctors and other medical professionals to treat all these newly insured individuals.  As demand increases, colleges profit as new people get educated to fill that demand.  Better colleges and more educated people leads to more advances in technology, and we regain the lead in technology.  These advances need manufacturers and distributors.  You get the idea.  Over all, the benefit to our economy far outweighs the debt we will gain.

A debt driven economy only works if you work quickly to pay off those debts. Just because debt is often necessary does not make spending more and more money that you don't have a good thing, nor does it justify it in the first place. You go to college and you spend money that you don't have on an education so you can get a better paying job with that education, else you would never aquire the funds to go to college in the first place (or take your whole life to do so). But what if you spend all that money on an education, get out in the working sector with that shiny new diploma but there are no new jobs to support the college debt that got you that education? Spending the money in the first place does not justify the spending of money you do not have. You have to use that money wisely and not stretch yourself so thin expecting that you can just take out another loan and the banks will always cover you. Why do you think the U.S. is in such a depression right now? You spend and invest money that doesn't exist, keeping that debt suspended in mid air like a juggler with too many balls. If something goes wrong in the cycle it all comes crashing down because none of it had any solid support in the first place which is why debt was always meant to be a temporary means to an end. If we were hit with another housing crisis or the entire market completely crashed, anyone with debt (doesn't matter how much, if your in the red, your in the red and you lose everything) is screwed and no amount of government bail outs (when the the federal and most state governments are at their limits financially already) is going to be there to save the day.

And i could talk all day about why public schools just plain fail. You have a massively inverse ratio of students to teachers that only want to teach the kids one thing, one way regardless of how the individual student best learns the material and that's assuming the material is accurate or being taught efficiently in the first place. Trying to teach kids like it's a mass production assembly line just doesn't work and does nothing for their critical thinking abilities. Giving the kids a whole bunch of medication to counter act poor eating habits and the teachers inability to teach doesn't help ether (you put a fuckton of processed unnatural sugar and caffeine in everything which does wonders to their attention spans not to mention their health and then you drown them with drugs that make them docile and brain dead, how does this work again?). Can you tell i don't have much confidence in public school systems and the FDA?