Author Topic: Invisibility?? (Read 1874 times)

BuriaL · « **on:** August 03, 2009, 07:58:14 PM »

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/07/090731121002.htm

I stumbled over this.

Might be just bullshit, seems like a serious site tho.

Semnae · « **Reply #1 on:** August 03, 2009, 08:44:35 PM »

I was about to say that this was a very old story, but then I noticed that the article was talking about Boston University, not the University of Tokyo. I then came to the startling realization that the US is technologically behind Japan by about three years.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKPVQal851U

Sosseres · « **Reply #2 on:** August 03, 2009, 09:04:02 PM »

Quote from: Semnae on August 03, 2009, 08:44:35 PM

I was about to say that this was a very old story, but then I noticed that the article was talking about Boston University, not the University of Tokyo. I then came to the startling realization that the US is technologically behind Japan by about three years.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKPVQal851U

EDIT

The article he linked is about bending light and through that making things invisible. The video linked uses projection technology.

They both have similar goals, just extremely different ways of accomplishing them. I personally think light bending will have more practical uses since one area can do the same as several mirrors.

I don't fully understand either method though, they are a bit similar in that they both modify light.

Path · « **Reply #3 on:** August 03, 2009, 09:26:15 PM »

In theory the concept seems simple, relatively; if you can bend light around an object, it'll effectively be rendered invisible. Of course, whatever is within the field will be rendered blind as well, since we rely on light to see. Less of a problem for installations and craft, since you could compensate using cameras or other methods, but personal invisibility seems like a stretch.

BuriaL · « **Reply #4 on:** August 03, 2009, 09:47:48 PM »

Quote from: Path on August 03, 2009, 09:26:15 PM

In theory the concept seems simple, relatively; if you can bend light around an object, it'll effectively be rendered invisible. Of course, whatever is within the field will be rendered blind as well, since we rely on light to see. Less of a problem for installations and craft, since you could compensate using cameras or other methods, but personal invisibility seems like a stretch.

If you filter the light then something like infrared or some other spectrum should be visible.
Or better yet, make the "light-bending" machine operate at a frequency and use the intervals to see.

Sosseres · « **Reply #5 on:** August 03, 2009, 09:54:49 PM »

Quote from: BuriaL on August 03, 2009, 09:47:48 PM

If you filter the light then something like infrared or some other spectrum should be visible.
Or better yet, make the "light-bending" machine operate at a frequency and use the intervals to see.

This is where the real difference between the methods is. One uses cameras, so you could still see depending on the material that transmits the light being transparent on one side, the other just bends light. So you would have to use light outside of the normal spectrum to see with. Which also means you will be visible in that spectrum. You could perhaps use a sonar system to "see" with?

BuriaL · « **Reply #6 on:** August 03, 2009, 10:10:29 PM »

A personal device could change the world. If you could bend light you could prolly project new light and bend that to. I imagine having a hi res, prerendered 3D model of a Blue cube instead of what i look like

Somehow i dont think well see "sci-fi" devices like that anytime soon. It would be kinda dangerous, i think.

Path · « **Reply #7 on:** August 03, 2009, 10:13:16 PM »

Quote from: BuriaL on August 03, 2009, 09:47:48 PM

If you filter the light then something like infrared or some other spectrum should be visible.
Or better yet, make the "light-bending" machine operate at a frequency and use the intervals to see.

Yes, but you'd still be visible in that spectrum as well. You'd have to use frequencies outside of the normal visible spectrum for obvious reasons, which create other problems.

Quote from: Sosseres on August 03, 2009, 09:54:49 PM

You could perhaps use a sonar system to "see" with?

Wouldn't you be rather be using radar normally? Though depending on the environment, it's one of several solutions that could work, depending on the scale. For large vehicles or crafts this would probably be easier, but these are typically relatively easy to detect without visual anyway. For personnel, radar or sonar seem far too imprecise.

Quote from: BuriaL on August 03, 2009, 10:10:29 PM

A personal device could change the world. If you could bend light you could prolly project new light and bend that to. I imagine having a hi res, prerendered 3D model of a Blue cube instead of what i look like

Seriously, that's more sci fi than science

Sosseres · « **Reply #8 on:** August 03, 2009, 10:24:53 PM »

Quote from: Path on August 03, 2009, 10:13:16 PM

Quote from: Sosseres on August 03, 2009, 09:54:49 PM
You could perhaps use a sonar system to "see" with?
Wouldn't you be rather be using radar normally? Though depending on the environment, it's one of several solutions that could work, depending on the scale. For large vehicles or crafts this would probably be easier, but these are typically relatively easy to detect without visual anyway. For personnel, radar or sonar seem far too imprecise.

I actually think it has promise since there are animals (dolphins, whales, bats) using a similar solution.

Though it doesn't solve the problem of invisibility vs seeing. Each spectrum you "see" in is one that you can be detected in. For military high altitude craft you wouldn't have to block the visible spectrum, just the radar spectrums so visibility isn't as large a problem.

fohfoh · « **Reply #9 on:** August 04, 2009, 11:44:47 AM »

Doesn't the original one require a static area that doesn't move and covers only it's "circular range" while this one can bend light in let's say an "oval range"?

Sosseres · « **Reply #10 on:** August 04, 2009, 12:28:24 PM »

As I understood the original it required you to be in a very specific angle to work due to the camera/computer system.

This new one doesn't have a showcase yet?

darkjedi · « **Reply #11 on:** August 04, 2009, 12:45:31 PM »

If you travel fast enough, your visual profile will shift to either infrared or UV spectrum through doppler effect, and you'll be effectively rendered invisible to some human observers. Just be sure to hole up yourself inside a refrigerator or something... And go any faster, you'll already be dead. Not very practical, but it's still feasible for covert space travel. (interstellar refrigerators lol, need patents)

mgz · « **Reply #12 on:** August 04, 2009, 12:47:03 PM »

didnt MIT demonstrate proof of concept of the light bending like 3 years back or so ?

It was also explained on a radio show i was listening to by dr kaku that more or less the biggest limitation they have with light bending = you cant see out of the area that has light bent around it since at the time i dont think we had the capability to choose what spectrum's of light were being bent not sure if the case is still true.

darkjedi · « **Reply #13 on:** August 04, 2009, 12:53:33 PM »

Maybe you can have everything except your eyes invisible lol

Reape · « **Reply #14 on:** August 04, 2009, 01:08:25 PM »

Lol, that would be a sight. Eyes flowing in the air.

Nanonanol · « **Reply #15 on:** August 04, 2009, 01:22:59 PM »

If you guys are interested in the physics behind these kind of things, check out Physics of the Impossible by Michio Kaku - he talks about the possiblity of some sci-fi ideas/contraptions in terms of modern physics that is being researched and how our understanding of physics might evolve in order to solve complex mysteries behind such ideas or contraptions (invisibility is one of the things he envisions as being relatively easily attainable for us).

But as far as space travel:

Quote from: darkjedi on August 04, 2009, 12:45:31 PM

If you travel fast enough, your visual profile will shift to either infrared or UV spectrum through doppler effect, and you'll be effectively rendered invisible to some human observers. Just be sure to hole up yourself inside a refrigerator or something... And go any faster, you'll already be dead. Not very practical, but it's still feasible for covert space travel. (interstellar refrigerators lol, need patents)

Who needs to worry about travelling in interstellar refrigerators when there is quantum entanglement ... sure it'll be a while before we can "teleport" more than a photon, but who knows?
http://physicsworld.com/cws/article/news/16883

darkjedi · « **Reply #16 on:** August 04, 2009, 01:38:15 PM »

I believe an interstellar refrigerator has a much simpler theoretical framework than paired quanta, so it will be easier to turn it mainstream... we can even construct it right now if we needed to, lol.

vicious796 · « **Reply #17 on:** August 04, 2009, 02:08:11 PM »

Bout damn time the Jetsons promises are being fufilled. Now just waiting on my disintegration ray.

mgz · « **Reply #18 on:** August 04, 2009, 02:14:20 PM »

Quote from: Nanonanol on August 04, 2009, 01:22:59 PM

If you guys are interested in the physics behind these kind of things, check out Physics of the Impossible by Michio Kaku - he talks about the possiblity of some sci-fi ideas/contraptions in terms of modern physics that is being researched and how our understanding of physics might evolve in order to solve complex mysteries behind such ideas or contraptions (invisibility is one of the things he envisions as being relatively easily attainable for us).

But as far as space travel:

Quote from: darkjedi on August 04, 2009, 12:45:31 PM
If you travel fast enough, your visual profile will shift to either infrared or UV spectrum through doppler effect, and you'll be effectively rendered invisible to some human observers. Just be sure to hole up yourself inside a refrigerator or something... And go any faster, you'll already be dead. Not very practical, but it's still feasible for covert space travel. (interstellar refrigerators lol, need patents)

Who needs to worry about travelling in interstellar refrigerators when there is quantum entanglement ... sure it'll be a while before we can "teleport" more than a photon, but who knows?
http://physicsworld.com/cws/article/news/16883

science channel is making it into a series coming in november

geoffreak · « **Reply #19 on:** August 06, 2009, 02:23:48 AM »

In theory we can do everything you imagine, and more.
It's the practicality of these theories that makes science difficult