TV Quality vs. PC Quality

[N.Maniac 64]

Well, at least there's OLED (slowly) coming around that is without a doubt better than LCD.

Also, if you're buying a tv and do any sort of gaming like stuff, MAKE SURE YOU CHECK FOR INPUT LAG.  I can't stress this enough.  It's the worst on interlaced SD resolution content.

[misachaos]

Well, at least there's OLED (slowly) coming around that is without a doubt better than LCD.

Also, if you're buying a tv and do any sort of gaming like stuff, MAKE SURE YOU CHECK FOR INPUT LAG.  I can't stress this enough.  It's the worst on interlaced SD resolution content.

Unput lag = When TV Flickers like crap?

[N.Maniac 64]

No, it's when you for example press the A button for Mario to jump, but he doesn't jump until a half second later.  There's a time gap between the source video and the output video.

[Xtras]

Can someone elaborate on the whole upscaling thing. Does that mean it converts low resolution footage to higher resolution? I have heard that some of the western digital media player hard drives, have the ability to render anime files in 1080p even if the file itself was a lower resolution. Essentially what I want to know is, for watching anime boxsets, especially for series that came out in the 90's (gundam wing, g gundam etc.), what would get me the best size and quality. Because I saw my neighbor watch DVD's on his new 1080p lcd, and I must say it looked like crap. Pixelation everywhere.

Money is not really a factor. I have a spending budget of about 10,000 dollars for the home theater of my dreams.

[misachaos]

No, it's when you for example press the A button for Mario to jump, but he doesn't jump until a half second later.  There's a time gap between the source video and the output video.

ooh... so the flickering on some games just means its a bad tv. mk thanks.

[N.Maniac 64]

Can someone elaborate on the whole upscaling thing. Does that mean it converts low resolution footage to higher resolution? I have heard that some of the western digital media player hard drives, have the ability to render anime files in 1080p even if the file itself was a lower resolution. Essentially what I want to know is, for watching anime boxsets, especially for series that came out in the 90's (gundam wing, g gundam etc.), what would get me the best size and quality. Because I saw my neighbor watch DVD's on his new 1080p lcd, and I must say it looked like crap. Pixelation everywhere.

Video upscaling is the exact same thing as if you took an image an resized it, but with video.

Example: Take image.png which is 800x600 in size.  Now to make it fit your desktop as a background, you resize it use the lanczos algorithm and bring it up to 1280x960

I'll admit though I don't have the best experience in this territory but something like an upscaling DVD player or a blu-ray player MIGHT do go.  Also you can never go wrong with a PC+GPU-upscaling combo.

[Xtras]

Can someone elaborate on the whole upscaling thing. Does that mean it converts low resolution footage to higher resolution? I have heard that some of the western digital media player hard drives, have the ability to render anime files in 1080p even if the file itself was a lower resolution. Essentially what I want to know is, for watching anime boxsets, especially for series that came out in the 90's (gundam wing, g gundam etc.), what would get me the best size and quality. Because I saw my neighbor watch DVD's on his new 1080p lcd, and I must say it looked like crap. Pixelation everywhere.

Video upscaling is the exact same thing as if you took an image an resized it, but with video.

Example: Take image.png which is 800x600 in size.  Now to make it fit your desktop as a background, you resize it use the lanczos algorithm and bring it up to 1280x960

I'll admit though I don't have the best experience in this territory but something like an upscaling DVD player or a blu-ray player MIGHT do go.  Also you can never go wrong with a PC+GPU-upscaling combo.

And how do I set up that PC + GPU upscaling thing. Currently I just play all my videos on WMP 12 with CCCP. My CPU is a Q6600 and my GPU is a Radeon HD 2600XT

It appears to me as if, so long as you have upscaling somewhere in the mix, whether with your PC or your Blu-Ray player, then you get crisp video anyway, am I correct. Just don't leave the TV to do the upscaling and it will work right

[N.Maniac 64]

Basically yeah.

Also I don't know about WMP, but I know Media Player Classic Home Cinema should be able to play everything WMP can play and has DXVA which is GPU accelerated playback so you can do all kinds of post-processing - the only problem is that you'd need at least an ATI HD series ATI or an Nvidia 8xxx series GPU in order to accelerate VC1 (ati only) and H.264 (both), but it seems you have that covered.

More info on DXVA in Media Player Classic Home Cinema:
http://mpc-hc.sourceforge.net/DXVASupport.html

[Rebs]

Take note that sometimes a DVD player ect. can have better playback capabilities than a computer due to the setup and specific hardware. However, I might be proven wrong, for I never really reseached this.

[misachaos]

Does HD support on a PC's gfx card help quality? I think the GeForce 6150Go has HD accelerators... or full support not sure. But yea the flickering screen for certian titles and shows on LCD tv's is a issue with LCD's mainly or resolution?

[N.Maniac 64]

I'm not sure about the flicker issue, but that may be related to the frame-rate not being divisible by 60 like 24fps movies.  I know that's one reason behind 120hz LCDs - 24fps goes into 120 perfectly.

As for HD stuff on the GPU, it CAN, but only through post-processing.  As for general playback, it just accelerates it (but it's that acceleration that gives you head room to do post-processing).

[misachaos]

Ah kay, too bad I know nothing about changing that stuff in the tv. lol
Im going to try that, because running FullScreen 1080 raw's  lags my pc.

[pparker]

...how do I set up that PC + GPU upscaling thing. Currently I just play all my videos on WMP 12 with CCCP. My CPU is a Q6600 and my GPU is a Radeon HD 2600XT

It appears to me as if, so long as you have upscaling somewhere in the mix, whether with your PC or your Blu-Ray player, then you get crisp video anyway, am I correct. Just don't leave the TV to do the upscaling and it will work right

It's really not that clear-cut, IMHO, having just been through this.  I bought a custom-built PC from my local guru shop specifically for HD video and gaming on a 1080p TV.  These guys have a lot of expertise behind the configuration they gave me, and it works great.  I do think the video card is key, though, in the upscaling success, assuming a fast processor and at least 4GB RAM that doesn't bottleneck the card.  The Blu-ray drive is nothing fancy, an LG, and works fine.  I was out the door for $1,400 including a nice gaming keyboard.  I could have spent $3,000, and I don't think it would have improved much.

To give you an example, I bought a copy of Arcsoft Total Media Theater Platinum for playing BD's/DVD's.  They sell an add-on upscaler, which I decided to buy and compare against the card's upscaling.  Worse quality as soon as I turned the plug-in on, and obvious.  Pixelation immediately.  I was watching the last few eps of Outlaw Star on R1 DVD at the time.  If any show is a challenge, it's those older shows on R1. Even on the card, I get some pixelation, but it's minor enough that I forget about it quick.  

To be honest, I haven't even tried setting different resolutions on the card to see what happens if the receiver or the TV does the upscaling.  I've watched the entire 720p Thora Macross Frontier and the first two seasons of Aria on R1 DVD, and they were virtually perfect.  

Another reason for needing raw power is the size/bitrate of 720p and 1080p files.  My 4 year old computer just wouldn't play them at all, even with upgrading to an ATI 3850 and adding RAM.  The CPU was the bottleneck.  The game Crysis could be played, but only the very lowest settings, and even then I got frame rates dipping below 15.  So if you have the money to spend as you say, don't be conservative on the PC.  I'm still using XP because my guru hates Vista (has to deal with all the problems, of course).  But I'll upgrade to Win7 64-bit, and I have room to upgrade my system as needed.  

Fast hard drive, fast CPU, the ATI HD card with HDMI output, and you should be fine.  I have HDMI from the PC to receiver, and just one HDMI from receiver to TV, since all audio goes into the receiver for the surround system.  The new Pioneer was only $500 even at BestBuy, and it's all HDMI/HDCP.  Which is one thing to be careful about... make sure every component is HDCP, or you'll be screwed for playing BD discs.  If you're a gamer and have or want a PS3, it's still the consensus that it's the best DVD upscaling hardware component on the market in addition to being a great BD player, but I have no proof of that personally.  So that's also an option.

If you want to take the time to research, go to www.avsforum.com and dive into the forums.  Lots of real hardcore video/audio geeks there with decades of experience.  That's how I found the TV and later verified the receiver.  Just don't listen to what anyone at BestBuy or on Amazon.com says...  (Newegg is not too bad for computer components, but I leave it to the pros)

[Takeshi]

TV quality ftw.

I use a VGA cabel and a sound cabel to connect my computer to the TV, and I WAS able to play emulators (PS1) on the TV, however, since I upgraded my ATI drivers it doesn't work, now, but the flicker that's vivisble when I play anime is gone.

I don't get why people want the trouble with burning to DVDs and then watching through DVD players.

[Xtras]

TV quality ftw.

I use a VGA cabel and a sound cabel to connect my computer to the TV, and I WAS able to play emulators (PS1) on the TV, however, since I upgraded my ATI drivers it doesn't work, now, but the flicker that's vivisble when I play anime is gone.

I don't get why people want the trouble with burning to DVDs and then watching through DVD players.

Unless you have a pretty high end graphics card, you will not get the same results if you connected your computer to the tv as if you connected a Blu-Ray player to the TV. Most graphics cards these days focus on the gaming side of things, while the GPU's in the Blu-Ray players focus on the upscaling to 1080p. (At least this was what I read in other forums)

[kurandoinu]

TV quality ftw.

I use a VGA cabel and a sound cabel to connect my computer to the TV, and I WAS able to play emulators (PS1) on the TV, however, since I upgraded my ATI drivers it doesn't work, now, but the flicker that's vivisble when I play anime is gone.

I don't get why people want the trouble with burning to DVDs and then watching through DVD players.

Unless you have a pretty high end graphics card, you will not get the same results if you connected your computer to the tv as if you connected a Blu-Ray player to the TV. Most graphics cards these days focus on the gaming side of things, while the GPU's in the Blu-Ray players focus on the upscaling to 1080p. (At least this was what I read in other forums)

But he didn't say why do people go to the trouble of burning blu-rays off, he said DVDs. I can't see where blu ray discs come into that at all.

[Xtras]

But he didn't say why do people go to the trouble of burning blu-rays off, he said DVDs. I can't see where blu ray discs come into that at all.

I didn't say Blu-Ray discs, I said blu-ray players. If you put a DVD in a good blu-ray player (or even in some of the newer high-tech DVD players) it will upscale it beyond the capability of most graphics cards that you put in your computer. (again, I haven't tried it but that is what I have read in multiple places)

[kurandoinu]

Ah, now that makes more sense. I have a DVD player that upscales, and it does a pretty good job for something that I bought from a second hand shop.

[Lupin]

Most graphics cards these days focus on the gaming side of things, while the GPU's in the Blu-Ray players focus on the upscaling to 1080p. (At least this was what I read in other forums)

It's not that graphics cards nowadays focus on gaming. Rather, gaming gets more attention when reviewing video cards because it strains the cards more than decoding. Some low-end and mid-range video cards are as capable as decoding video as those high end cards.

[bloody000]

TV quality ftw.

I use a VGA cabel and a sound cabel to connect my computer to the TV, and I WAS able to play emulators (PS1) on the TV, however, since I upgraded my ATI drivers it doesn't work, now, but the flicker that's vivisble when I play anime is gone.

I don't get why people want the trouble with burning to DVDs and then watching through DVD players.

Unless you have a pretty high end graphics card, you will not get the same results if you connected your computer to the tv as if you connected a Blu-Ray player to the TV. Most graphics cards these days focus on the gaming side of things, while the GPU's in the Blu-Ray players focus on the upscaling to 1080p. (At least this was what I read in other forums)

Actually computers CAN do a better job at that. there are many upscaling algorithms to choose from, and the analog outputs of most desktop video cards are excellent.