Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann

[deathman]

Thats because along with the protagonist of Needless and Spike... i dont remember a character more EPIC than ......THE LEADER OF THE GURREN BRIGADE!!!A MAN WITH A SOUL AS STRONG AS HIS BACK....THE GREAT DEMON THE BIG LEADER..KAMINA-SAMA IS THE MAN YOU ARE TALKING WITH........

And yet, he died pitifully...

Sorry, but even though I watched it to completion, I still think TTGL was fairly bleh...

you sir are about to get lynched

Also to the OP that song can be found in the OST, not sure what it's called I deleted most of mine, but I know it's on there

You won't find a tree brave enough...

Kamina was the lord... because of his death people were able to move forward in Tengen Toppa.....saying that Kamina died pitifully is just stupid...okay you did not like it(well that shows a lot....) but okay you cant state that Kamina died pitifully i mean...Kamina's death was even more epic and sad than Lelouch's...

[Eseuldor]

Thats because along with the protagonist of Needless and Spike... i dont remember a character more EPIC than ......THE LEADER OF THE GURREN BRIGADE!!!A MAN WITH A SOUL AS STRONG AS HIS BACK....THE GREAT DEMON THE BIG LEADER..KAMINA-SAMA IS THE MAN YOU ARE TALKING WITH........

And yet, he died pitifully...

Sorry, but even though I watched it to completion, I still think TTGL was fairly bleh...

you sir are about to get lynched

Also to the OP that song can be found in the OST, not sure what it's called I deleted most of mine, but I know it's on there

You won't find a tree brave enough...

Kamina was the lord... because of his death people were able to move forward in Tengen Toppa.....saying that Kamina died pitifully is just stupid...okay you did not like it(well that shows a lot....) but okay you cant state that Kamina died pitifully i mean...Kamina's death was even more epic and sad than Lelouch's...

Maybe he is your god, lord and savior. Or was he just a typical Martyr who died in a rather weak and powerless state? And my not liking TTGL shows what exactly? You should elaborate that point and bring forth the wisdom of your faith.

Kamina had died not just because his death would inspire the Spirals to victory, but also because another universe, anchored in deep space, needed his presence. This universe, which suffers from the grand delusion of self-comfort, of visual novel adaptations, of inhumane killings on nice boats, and of Burmese monks protesting on the streets, needed a leader.

Is this what you believe?

[BrownMasterV]

What part of his death was pitiful? The man quite literally fought to the death, and that earns badass points in my book.

[Jbstormburst]

What part of his death was pitiful? The man quite literally fought to the death, and that earns badass points in my book.

Agreed.  He SACRIFICED himself in order to kill General Thymilph, who Simon alone would have NO chance of killing at that point.  And, he didn't die until AFTER he killed him.  That alone takes immense will.  If you say sacrifice and will are pitiful, you really have no true values, now do you?

Oh, expect to be lynched, sir.

[tomoya-kun]

What part of his death was pitiful? The man quite literally fought to the death, and that earns badass points in my book.

Agreed.  He SACRIFICED himself in order to kill General Thymilph, who Simon alone would have NO chance of killing at that point.  And, he didn't die until AFTER he killed him.  That alone takes immense will.  If you say sacrifice and will are pitiful, you really have no true values, now do you?

Oh, expect to be lynched, sir.

What part of his death was pitiful? The man quite literally fought to the death, and that earns badass points in my book.

+1

[deathman]

Thats because along with the protagonist of Needless and Spike... i dont remember a character more EPIC than ......THE LEADER OF THE GURREN BRIGADE!!!A MAN WITH A SOUL AS STRONG AS HIS BACK....THE GREAT DEMON THE BIG LEADER..KAMINA-SAMA IS THE MAN YOU ARE TALKING WITH........

And yet, he died pitifully...

Sorry, but even though I watched it to completion, I still think TTGL was fairly bleh...

you sir are about to get lynched

Also to the OP that song can be found in the OST, not sure what it's called I deleted most of mine, but I know it's on there

You won't find a tree brave enough...

Kamina was the lord... because of his death people were able to move forward in Tengen Toppa.....saying that Kamina died pitifully is just stupid...okay you did not like it(well that shows a lot....) but okay you cant state that Kamina died pitifully i mean...Kamina's death was even more epic and sad than Lelouch's...

Maybe he is your god, lord and savior. Or was he just a typical Martyr who died in a rather weak and powerless state? And my not liking TTGL shows what exactly? You should elaborate that point and bring forth the wisdom of your faith.

Kamina had died not just because his death would inspire the Spirals to victory, but also because another universe, anchored in deep space, needed his presence. This universe, which suffers from the grand delusion of self-comfort, of visual novel adaptations, of inhumane killings on nice boats, and of Burmese monks protesting on the streets, needed a leader.

Is this what you believe?

Man have you actually seen the show....if you had then recall how Kamina died ..if you state that this is pitifull...WAKE UP MAN HE WAS A FUCKING ANIME HERO.......he was half dead but he used his last spiral energy to face one of the 4 generals and actually helped simon kill him while in the previous 3 minutes he had a gigantic spear piercing him in the chest.....

[Legacy]

If it wasn't for kamina then everyone else would've probably died at that time.

[pipitugaboy]

Kamina was, is and stays one of the best anime characters ever created!
Even thou he lasted not to many episodes sadly  The memories about him are just epic!

[Fool010]

Seconded, he's the most epicly retarded char I've ever came across. His "bravery" doesn't come from courage but from his incapacity to perceive danger.

Bravery stems from your ability to overcome your fears, not from your inability to realize you're in danger.

This isn't the kind of guy I would follow into war, 'cause he'll get himself and all his followers killed without achieving anything. Dying in a an heroic fashion may look good, but in the end you have no profit from it. Kamina isn't a martyr, neither a hero. He died in a stupid and spectacular way because he acted without thinking about consequences, just like he did all his life.

He saved the others ... from a situation he caused. Had he been just remotely less stupid, it wouldn't have happened.

Now, the story needed him to die because it pushed the cast forward, but there's nothing admirable in what he did. Dying at war isn't hard to do, you just have to get killed.

This may look manly for teenagers or when you're in your early twens, but I'm way past that stage.

[deathman]

Seconded, he's the most epicly retarded char I've ever came across. His "bravery" doesn't come from courage but from his incapacity to perceive danger.

Bravery stems from your ability to overcome your fears, not from your inability to realize you're in danger.

This isn't the kind of guy I would follow into war, 'cause he'll get himself and all his followers killed without achieving anything. Dying in a an heroic fashion may look good, but in the end you have no profit from it. Kamina isn't a martyr, neither a hero. He died in a stupid and spectacular way because he acted without thinking about consequences, just like he did all his life.

He saved the others ... from a situation he caused. Had he been just remotely less stupid, it wouldn't have happened.

Now, the story needed him to die because it pushed the cast forward, but there's nothing admirable in what he did. Dying at war isn't hard to do, you just have to get killed.

This may look manly for teenagers or when you're in your early twens, but I'm way past that stage.

How the fuck do you define manly.......The man was fearless he wasnt stupid he just had a dream he wanted to achieve he pursued his ideals and it was him who put people out of the pits they lived him who stood up against an empire him who despite being beaten and pierced through the heart stood and helped his comrades by managing to kill the general
It was him who gave them the gigantic ship as their base......he was brave he knew all along he would die early because exactly of his bravery..thats why he kept believing in Simon and having him under his protection despite simon being a chicken at the time....because he knew that simon could make up for his loss he could stand in his place....saying that Kamina was not a hero ..it is just plain stupidity..He was an inspiration for all of the characters...

[Fool010]

Someone who jumps headfirst into action without any plan, counting on luck and dying in the process isn't brave ... he's just stupid.
He "saved" them from a menace he subjected them to.
Being fearless doesn't equate to bravery, that's just being oblivious. Real brave people still feel fear, but are able to surpass it. Kamina wasn't even able to perceive danger. The fearless ones die because that's all they can do, the brave ones die once they've used up all other options.
He took the easy way out and died along the way, leaving most of the work to the others. Oh, and he wasn't a "man", he was a kid with dreams of grandeur and heroic deeds. And he died the day reality came knocking at his door.
Seriously, "he was brave he knew all along he would die early because exactly of his bravery" ... the perspective he could die didn't even cross his mind.

PS : I just realized you actually didn't read my whole post. You basicaly react to the first and last sentence, are you aware I elaborated my thoughts in between ?

[deathman]

First of all i read your post...despite the fact that you have serious gaps in knowledge regarding Kamina's death i will say once again he did not count in luck he counted in his powers he believed in himself is it that difficult for you to understand ???Also do you seriously believe that he left the hard work to others??WTF no man wants to die...He achieved so much...He sacrificed himself in order to snap up Simon...Simon was the fucking reason Kamina died now i leave ideological bullshit to you....

[Fool010]

I'd appreciate a answer that makes sense, not some kiddie pouting. I have no "gaps in knowledge", I just watched the series with a bit more critical mind instead of going ooh and wee about how "manly" acting like a thoughtless primate is.
It all would've made sense if TTGL had been a parody, but unfortunately Gainax didn't go all the way in that direction, which spoiled a lot of the fun the series could've been. There's only a small gap between larger than life and caricature, and I consider TTGL as a whole and Kamina in particular to be on the wrong side of the line.

"Counting on his power", "Sacrificed himself" ?

Dude, I'm no longer 14. It takes much more to impress me. Which is probably the main reason for my distaste, I'm already a couple of years past being the target audience. I saw the series as an attempt at over the top entertainement, but certainly not as a lesson about life.

[deathman]

I'd appreciate a answer that makes sense, not some kiddie pouting. I have no "gaps in knowledge", I just watched the series with a bit more critical mind instead of going ooh an wee about how "manly" acting like a thoughtless primate is.
It all would've made sense if TTGL had been a parody, but unfortunately Gainax didn't go all the way in that direction, which spoiled a lot of the fun the series could've been.
"Counting on his power", "Sacrificed himself" ?

Dude, I'm no longer 14. It takes much more to impress me.

I am no 14 either...but hell again you cant deny that he was interesting ..back when i watched TTGL i was indeed 14 if i recall....3 years have passed i think since then....Well i hope you find what impresses you ..because if one of Gainax's masterpieces did not impress you...well go watch pokemon

[AceD]

A lot of us posting here are probably 20+ from what i remember from a poll...let alone 14 >.>

[Eseuldor]

So the consensus is as follows, If you don't think Kamina was brave and subsequently the most epic of the epicfolk in all epicdom and prefer to think of him as someone who invariably caused more trouble than he resolved, then your apparently not knowledgeable about the human species and should only watch Poke'mon.

That alone spells out a lot about the Kamina fans...

[AceD]

Obviously Excalibur is the most epic of the epicfolk in all epicdom.

[BrownMasterV]

I always saw Kamina as a parody of the overly manly characters of most shounen anime.
Regardless of his bravery (or stupidity), he was still fucking awesome

@deathman and Fool010 both of you really need to stop thinking so much. (although Fool is doing most of the thinking)

Just like they say in the anime "Go beyond the impossible and kick reason to the curb!" i.e. don't rely on reason while watching this show.

[Fool010]

I don't mind TTGL going overboard, but at some point the series went to places I didn't want to go. I enjoyed the first arc, which I found to be fresh and entertaining, but everything after that got drowned in an ever increasing stream of overkill. I consider the series to be a prime example of the too much of a good thing principle. What irks me the most about Kamina is that he lacks any of the shades and cracks that could've made him more than a cardboard cutout silhouette. From a purely narrative point of view, his sole purpose was to die because the shock of his disappearence was needed to fuel further events. My problem is I never got attached to him, therefore I felt nothing when he went away.
I do regret Gainax didn't choose to make a pure parody, because then I would've been able to enjoy to a further extent. But then again, I should not complain that something that doesn't target me doesn't respond to my expectations. I reacted because I read some lines I couldn't agree with. There's no topic you can't disagree on and having most of the people having the same opinion still doesn't mean there's no reason to disagree.
On a side note, maybe I've lost the ability to feel enthousiasm ... if I ever had it at some point, but that's a matter of personal life experience. Analysing causes and consequences, even in human relationships is a main component in my line of work and it has turned into a second nature for me. It's not something I can turn off at will.

[eme13]

I don't mind TTGL going overboard, but at some point the series went to places I didn't want to follow it. I enjoyed the first arc, which i found to be fresh and entertaining, but everything after that got drowned in an ever increasing stream of overkill. I consider the series to be a prime example of the too much of a good thing principle.
What irks me the most about Kamina is that he lacks any of the shades and cracks that could've made him more than a cardboard cutout silhouette.
From a purely narrative point of view, his sole purpose was to die because the shock of his disappearence was needed to fuel further events. My problem is I never got attached to him, therefore I felt nothing when he went away.
I do regret Gainax didn't choose to make a pure parody, because then I would've been able to enjoy to a further extent. But then again, I should not complain that something that doesn't target me doesn't respond to my expectations.
I reacted because I read some lines I couldn't agree with. There's no topic you can't disagree on and having most of the people having the same opinion still doesn't mean there's no reason to disagree.
On a side note, maybe I've lost the ability to feel enthousiasm ... if I ever had it at some point, but that's a matter of personal life experience. Analysing causes and consequences, even in human relationships is a main component in my line of work and it has turned into a second nature for me. It's not something I can turn off at will.

I'll agree that the way Kamina's character was written, he was purely a plot device so that Simon could take center stage as the one to basically kick ass and take names later. BUT~~ I will totally disagree that he was a "cardboard cutout." Sure, he wasn't around for a very long time, and sure, you might not have grown as attached to him as other characters, but the night before they went into battle, he admitted to others that he too was scared, but he found a lot of his courage in Simon, and that he had his own reasons to fight.

For me, when Kamina died, it was like, "is that really it? Isn't he supposed to be the one to take it all the way?" IT was only AFTER he died that I loved his character all the more, because if he hadn't have died, then nothing would have really changed. I know how much of a crap answer that sounds like, but it's like... how many characters in anime die, and then never get brought up again, thus cheapening the importance of their role in the story? Lots, right? But Kamina's character constantly got brought up and sourced as the one of the things that helped drive Simon and others to keep up the good fight.

As for the show being a parody/satire, I think that maybe at first that's how they wanted to hook viewers, but I don't really think that was their intent all along. IT's kind of like... expecting Sengoku Basara to follow history 100%. No, part of the reason I loved Sengoku Basara was because it was ridiculous, but then you have the "shit just got real" moments, just like in TTGL.

Obviously Excalibur is the most epic of the epicfolk in all epicdom.

Agreed that Excalibur is AMAZING.