Author Topic: 1984 VS Brave New World (Read 3292 times)

kyoterry · « **on:** February 18, 2010, 07:28:15 PM »

If you had to choose between which is more accurate in portraying the collapse of human liberties to an oppressing government, which would it be?

Thoughts? Opinions?

KoC · « **Reply #1 on:** February 18, 2010, 08:17:58 PM »

Okay... WHo the fuck let Kyoterry back in?!

I'm looking at you, Ale.

surdumil · « **Reply #2 on:** February 18, 2010, 08:42:10 PM »

We were forced to read both in high school English lit, so both are right up there as far as being oppressive.

Humanoidz · « **Reply #3 on:** February 18, 2010, 09:28:11 PM »

Gosh it's been a decade since I've read 1984 and perhaps 4 years since Brave New World (I read Brave New World as a post college adult).
From what I can remember, Brave New World was heavy on social structure with a distinct upper and lower class. And 1984 being pretty Soviet in how they governed. I can't remember too much.

On the surface though, I would say 1984 is more oppressive and we've seen it partly in the Soviet Union, North Korea, and perhaps Cuba to an extent. On the other hand, the people chose that form of government (USSR) until it destroyed itself.

fohfoh · « **Reply #4 on:** February 19, 2010, 09:20:41 AM »

Quote from: KoC on February 18, 2010, 08:17:58 PM

Okay... WHo the fuck let Kyoterry back in?!

I'm looking at you, Ale.

I'm innocent!

molbjerg · « **Reply #5 on:** February 19, 2010, 10:33:34 AM »

I mean usually I'm happy when an oldie comes back.....

AntiPaladin · « **Reply #6 on:** February 19, 2010, 08:09:51 PM »

I think they're actually at their best when combined. 1984 is based on a much shorter-term plan (pacify the populace and make them dependent on the government) that wasn't as far-reaching. In that world, they tried to control the people's lives, but not their thoughts as much, and certainly not their religion (merely tried to extinguish it) I see BNW as the long-term extension of the same programs - after you pacify the populace and change their views on the role of a government, you change their very belif system to conform to the world you're trying to create.

KoC · « **Reply #7 on:** February 19, 2010, 10:20:37 PM »

Quote from: AntiPaladin on February 19, 2010, 08:09:51 PM

I think they're actually at their best when combined. 1984 is based on a much shorter-term plan (pacify the populace and make them dependent on the government) that wasn't as far-reaching. In that world, they tried to control the people's lives, but not their thoughts as much, and certainly not their religion (merely tried to extinguish it) I see BNW as the long-term extension of the same programs - after you pacify the populace and change their views on the role of a government, you change their very belif system to conform to the world you're trying to create.

They created a whole language which lacked whole aspects in order to prevent people from thinking about them, how is that not trying to control their thoughts?!

Xiong Chiamiov · « **Reply #8 on:** February 20, 2010, 06:40:05 AM »

1984 was boring as hell (so disappointing). Brave New World was pretty good. No opinions on whatever you actually asked.

kyoterry · « **Reply #9 on:** February 20, 2010, 06:14:36 PM »

haha yes, I'm back. KoC you've missed me most of all! ^.^

Why does it only have to be the government that oppresses its people? What about the entertainment industry? They create mindless zombies who only think about
the latest fashion, or newest gadgets. Those that have been socially conditioned to think the way the media wants it.
It's as if they were living in their own perfect reality show, while the rest of the world is clueless to them.

It's scary, knowing many who would prefer to focus on their materialistic possessions than value what some people don't have, civil liberties.

Since we're on the topic of liberties and governments, then let me ask you guys this:

If WW3 were started, a)who would be to blame? b)why? c)where would the warfare start? d) who would win?

Xiong Chiamiov · « **Reply #10 on:** February 20, 2010, 06:50:16 PM »

Quote from: kyoterry on February 20, 2010, 06:14:36 PM

Why does it only have to be the government that oppresses its people? What about the entertainment industry?

You evidentally don't read much science fiction.

Quote

Since we're on the topic of liberties and governments, then let me ask you guys this:

If WW3 were started, a)who would be to blame? b)why? c)where would the warfare start? d) who would win?

That's... not really on the topic.

Temuthril · « **Reply #11 on:** February 20, 2010, 08:15:30 PM »

1984 > Brave New World.

Not in terms of how accurate of a description they are, I just enjoyed reading 1984 more.

AntiPaladin · « **Reply #12 on:** February 22, 2010, 05:11:32 PM »

I think you can make an argument for either, KoC. I see that simply as an extension of the habitual use of euphemisms and PC language, not simply by the Government but by the populace in general. Similar to the idea that the media doesn't tell you what to think, but what to think about - you can still describe certain events and thoughts, but it takes more effort than most people are willing to put out in both speaking and understanding.

kostya · « **Reply #13 on:** March 03, 2010, 03:49:45 AM »

It has been a while since I read the two books so I am a little rusty on details, but if I recall correctly, 1984 government was most concerned with controlling peoples minds (the concept of a thoughtcrime, two minute hate, and the idea that the government can make 2+2=5). BNW was more about pacifying the masses with Soma and fetal alcohol so they would be too drugged/mentally handicapped to care.

KoC · « **Reply #14 on:** March 03, 2010, 03:56:38 AM »

Quote from: kostya on March 03, 2010, 03:49:45 AM

It has been a while since I read the two books so I am a little rusty on details, but if I recall correctly, 1984 government was most concerned with controlling peoples minds (the concept of a thoughtcrime, two minute hate, and the idea that the government can make 2+2=5). BNW was more about pacifying the masses with Soma and fetal alcohol so they would be too drugged/mentally handicapped to care.

THANK YOU.

And you clearly haven't either read 1984, AntiPaladin, or you can't think using your brainmeats.

Jianfre · « **Reply #15 on:** March 06, 2010, 06:27:02 PM »

1984 is true in many aspects.

The idea of a thought crime exists, especially with terrorism. 1984 is scarier because it is coming true. Especially how some of the technology came FROM 1984. Like head phones and the wall sized tvs and the concept of interactive programming. For the time it was outlandish and scary... but it becoming more and more real.

Temuthril · « **Reply #16 on:** March 06, 2010, 10:48:38 PM »

(click to show/hide)

sephiro499 · « **Reply #17 on:** March 10, 2010, 05:32:34 AM »

Brave new world, Huxley admitted during a speech in the 60 at UC berkeley that it was non fiction.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a1vMWjknRzw

He said 'people will learn to love their servitude.'

AoG · « **Reply #18 on:** March 10, 2010, 07:58:40 AM »

I dont know why everyone hates on brave new world as a dystopia. It seems like a pretty sweet place to live. We are all servants to our culture and society there is always an upper and a lower. A society that manages to keep the lower truly happy and the upper truly happy is a place that anyone would love to be born into.

What people fail to understand is they take there current thinking and attitudes and place themselves into the situation. When this would not be the case your being and who you are is not set at the creation of your life. It is something molded and developed(nurture) sure genetics(nature) plays a part but Huxley accounted for this by manipulating it. So those things that people feel they would be unhappy with and are wrong would not make people unhappy and would not be wrong because no one thinks there wrong. Right and wrong is an invention of man. So what ever man thinks is right at any given time is right and what ever man thinks is wrong at any given time is wrong and it is bound to change as man changes.

r-18 · « **Reply #19 on:** October 10, 2010, 01:26:18 AM »

brave new world was probably worse in the way it was embraced by the people ...but if you want to read a book that makes both look like a picnick in the park ...read .." we "

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_(novel)