"Server" computer suggestions

[Sosseres]

I am considering getting a silent box with low power requirements to run as my computer that is up 24/7. I would most likely want slots for 6-8 HDDs and if possible dual (built in?) network cards unless that increases costs so much that a router is cheaper. Size isn't a consideration since the price limits more.

The problem I see is that that many HDDs generate a bit of heat when used, considering I want a minimum of fans and any I do need to be silent, how do I solve that?

I have heard about NAS and so on, but most of the ones I've checked seems to be severely lacking in the HDD department (I consider 4 TB to be the absolute minimum).



How do I get that other computer to send a network signal at a specific time to start up the better computer so it is running when I get home?


I would use the same monitor for both of them, main one on DVI and the other one (which hardly needs screen time) on VGA.


I could perhaps replace my current Lian Li  PC - V1110 with a new chassi for the main computer since it can't handle the heat without a side open.

[Pentium100]

Depending on your budget -

Intel Atom - small size, low power, but only two integrates SATA ports and one GbE port, so you would need to choose between two network ports or a lot of drives.

Some low power desktop board + CPU - uses more power, is bigger, but you can connect as many HDDs as you want and add a second network card (or a dual port one).

As for the noise, I cannot advise anything, since I buy loud fans to keep my computers cool (and only one of my computers* overheated and shut down for ~1hour when my room was at 39 degrees one day, and after I cleaned the dust out of the power supplies of the overheated computer, it did not overheat again when the room was at 39 degrees). I buy fans with ball bearings (reliability) and usually the fastest of their size (effectiveness).

* an old server - this was not built by me, and has critical case temperature at 40 degrees (still works if it's 41 though).

How do I get that other computer to send a network signal at a specific time to start up the better computer so it is running when I get home?

WakeOnLAN - if your network card does not support it, get another one.

I would use the same monitor for both of them, main one on DVI and the other one (which hardly needs screen time) on VGA.

I recommend buying a KVM switch, or you will have two mice and two keyboards. Or just use remote control to control that PC.

[flyawave]

Scythe Gently Typhoon fans are quiet at less than 1500RPM and are very powerful. at about 1700RPM they aren't loud, but they aren't quiet either. The noise they make is like a low growl, not like other fans that hum. it's like ambient rumbles. I would definitely get those and replace any loud stock fans. so long as their not at full speed all you can hear is the air moving in the case

[Pentium100]

Scythe Gently Typhoon fans are quiet at less than 1500RPM and are very powerful.

Comparison:

GentleTyphoon 12cm case fan @ 1,850 rpm: 0.083 A - 28 dBA - 98 m³/h
Sunon EEC0251B1-A99 12cm x 12cm x 2.5cm @ 3100RPM; ~44dBA - 183.8m³/h. 8.4EUR

Still, a louder fan produces twice the airflow and it isn't so loud anyway. In my room that is.

[flyawave]

the tone from the fan is very different. don't knock it till you try it

[Pentium100]

the tone from the fan is very different. don't knock it till you try it

That may be, but as I have a lot of computers that make some noise, a single small (12cm) fan cannot be heard more than 20cm away. On the other hand, I use one big fan to cool my room (25.4cm, 2100RPM, 57dBA, 1376m^3/h), that is, suck colder air from outside, when it's hot and a smaller fan to cool myself when it's even hotter (17cm, 2800RPM, 51dBA, 344m^3/h). Those fans mostly look like big computer fans.

But yea, tone can be different, the 17cm fan makes high pitched noise and can be heard from further away than the 25cm fan even though the bigger fan is more noisy according to specs.

[Xiong Chiamiov]

What are you planning on using this computer for?

If it's not a media center, then you can save quite a bit on processor speed, and don't need a video card.  A GUI isn't even needed at all, but you may want one, depending on how comfortable you are with the commandline.

Look for slower-rpm harddrives.  I use Western Digital Greens myself.  You should plan to use some sort of redundant RAID, so make sure that you have space for more drives than you need for storage.

I used to have a log somewhere from when kureshii recommended a bunch of stuff when I built mine, but I don't know where it's gotten to...

[kureshii]

It’s simple common sense, but it bears repeating: If you don’t want too much heat in a case, don’t put too much heat into it Get a modest processor and chipset, and you’ll only have the hard drives to worry about. An Intel Pentium/Celeron dual-core or Core i3 build if you’re feeling rich, otherwise a simple Athlon II X2 system should readily suffice.

Go with low power hard drives: Spinpoint F3s, Barracuda LPs, Caviar Greens. You can easily google reviews of them, but I generally buy based on warranty period. Seconded on having some sort of RAID if you’re using that many drives; it will give you at least some peace of mind if one drive should suddenly fail. Hardware RAID costs serious money, so if you just want a simple setup, I think software RAID should easily suffice. Excepting the netbook processors, any modern dual-core should easily have enough muscle to manage at least that much, if you’re not building an enterprise-class server that has to service thousands of users or more.

V1110 looks like a good case for the server. If you don’t have too many hard drives they’ll easily all fit within the lower compartment, though you might want to put some of them in the upper compartment to avoid concentrating heat. The Gentle Typhoons are a good pick; one of few fans that are silent and yet have good static pressure. But the V1110 should be able to suppress noise from normal fans with the cover closed, so don’t worry too much about that.

For adding drives to the optical bays, you could use Lian Li’s own hard drive bays if you don’t mind spending quite a bit. For something cheaper, Cooler Master’s 4-in-3 bay module is a good choice as well. For budget solutions, just go for a simple hard drive to optical bay adapter, or DIY

As for having your personal desktop start up before you reach home, I find it is often easier to just put it into standby, then wake it again when you want to use it. It consumes minimal power in that state (a few watts), and is ready to use within seconds of waking.

There are motherboards with dual gigabit ports, though I don’t really see the need for them in a simple home server (unless you have cash to burn). A PCIe x1 gigabit wired network card is cheap and readily available almost everywhere.

[bork]

Take a look at the Antec 300 case.  Its a relative low cost chassis with a large amount of drive space room.  No fancy drive mounting hardware, have to mount the drives into their slots by screws.  The large fans make minimal noise in ether low or high speed. 

[flyawave]

+1 for spinpoint F3 not super quiet, but quite quiet

[K7IA]

haha, hisashiburi kureshii back in technology board

[datora]

.

"A problem well stated is a problem half solved."

So, uh, do you have a budget in mind?  Firm limits &/or fuzzy limits?

Operating system?

How many TB of storage do you want?  Target?  Like, 12 TB (6x 2TB), or more?

You seem to be saying you want this to be on 24/7 ... but are you also saying you want it to be your workstation at the same time?  Are your workstation and your server (intended to be) two separate machines?

And, what are you "serving" to ..?  One or two computers in your house?  The Internet?  A dozen other computers?  Managing a VPN?


It seems you're looking for a massive storage solution that you can access from one or two points.  Access could be direct via switch (in-house), or managed via a router, or through an actual box constructed/configured as a fileserver/firewall.  Is it intended that your server handle only file management, or will you be running apps/games/streaming multimedia/ etc.?  Across the Internet?

The device that acts as your server/router is a separate consideration from your storage array.  You can turn an old laptop into a linux server, so long as it has "high-enough" data throughput to the storage solution.  It's a matter of where you want to apply available funds/resources.  Buy a new CPU box, or rebuild an older one?  Free those funds up to invest in very reliable storage solution that meets noise & cooling needs.

If budget is not too much the limiting factor, you could consider getting 2x (or more) NAS solutions.  For example, this would hold 4x 2.5" drives:

 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822108032

Has Gbit ethernet & eSATA.  Would be very quiet & cool compared to 3.5" drives, and each NAS could have have 4x 1TB drives today.  Add new NAS when you need your next 4GB chunk ... or, larger drives probably available "soon."  Two of these running off a microATX mini-box with something like an AMD Phenom II X2 core (and, that would be overkill, but 'comfortably adequate' into the future).  Or a good router.

Gbit network cards come in both PCI and PCIe w/ solid Intel NICs coming in ~$30, so you have options to add them in to older systems &/or mix & match on a newer board.  But, maybe just get a Gbit switch and let your network server/router figure it out from there ... meaning, one RJ45 to your NAS stack via switch and another off to the rest of the network.


So, it seems the question is, do you need a server?  Maybe you just need a storage solution?

[Sosseres]

Thanks for the feedback people. I'll take it into consideration when looking at what to buy this or next weekend and post back with some more concrete things then.

So, uh, do you have a budget in mind?  Firm limits &/or fuzzy limits?

I do not have a set limit, I just don't want to get an overly expensive solution for no real reason. So limit at $2k or so, though I don't want to get near that.

Operating system?

I have a legal version of 7 lying around here, could also get a linux distro for it if I wanted to...

How many TB of storage do you want?  Target?  Like, 12 TB (6x 2TB), or more?

I actually stated that in the OP, a minimum of 4 TB. That is what I need, I can always use more. ^^

You seem to be saying you want this to be on 24/7 ... but are you also saying you want it to be your workstation at the same time?  Are your workstation and your server (intended to be) two separate machines?

Two separate machines, there were several things in the OP that pointed towards that. Like LAN wake-up, two network cards/router. I basically want a file server since my current setup is annoying sound wise due to being powerful without water cooling or great fans. This also leads to high wattage for something on 24/7.

And, what are you "serving" to ..?  One or two computers in your house?  The Internet?  A dozen other computers?  Managing a VPN?

First case is my own computer. Might climb to two if somebody is over here. In the long term (if I get a good connection) I might use it as a file server online. Hence the "" marks around it.

It seems you're looking for a massive storage solution that you can access from one or two points.  Access could be direct via switch (in-house), or managed via a router, or through an actual box constructed/configured as a fileserver/firewall.  Is it intended that your server handle only file management, or will you be running apps/games/streaming multimedia/ etc.?  Across the Internet?

In-house since I do not have the connection to use it from other places. It is meant for file management, heaviest usage would probably be mounting isos from another computer or watching HD content on another computer from this computer's hdd.

The device that acts as your server/router is a separate consideration from your storage array.  You can turn an old laptop into a linux server, so long as it has "high-enough" data throughput to the storage solution.  It's a matter of where you want to apply available funds/resources.  Buy a new CPU box, or rebuild an older one?  Free those funds up to invest in very reliable storage solution that meets noise & cooling needs.

If budget is not too much the limiting factor, you could consider getting 2x (or more) NAS solutions.  For example, this would hold 4x 2.5" drives:

 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822108032

Has Gbit ethernet & eSATA.  Would be very quiet & cool compared to 3.5" drives, and each NAS could have have 4x 1TB drives today.  Add new NAS when you need your next 4GB chunk ... or, larger drives probably available "soon."  Two of these running off a microATX mini-box with something like an AMD Phenom II X2 core (and, that would be overkill, but 'comfortably adequate' into the future).  Or a good router.

Gbit network cards come in both PCI and PCIe w/ solid Intel NICs coming in ~$30, so you have options to add them in to older systems &/or mix & match on a newer board.  But, maybe just get a Gbit switch and let your network server/router figure it out from there ... meaning, one RJ45 to your NAS stack via switch and another off to the rest of the network.


So, it seems the question is, do you need a server?  Maybe you just need a storage solution?

Basically I do need a storage solution that does torrenting, some other minor things I want on 24/7. Either switching port on the screen or remote management with gui is probably useful for some of the things I would have running but not needed. The NAS you linked is the type I don't want due to too few HDD ports, something I also mentioned in the OP. I dislike the solution of multiples of them.

I do not have any useful old hardware lying around as far as I know. I could probably move one or two hdd from my current box as well as taking the chassi as I mentioned. Other than that I give away old computer parts to relatives or friends instead of having them lying around. I am not interested in upgrading my main computer (at this time) since it can play games such as SC2 on ultra and has an i7 in it.

[rostheferret]

Your main PC would be limited playing games by the graphics card, not the processor, though this is besides the point of the question being asked. If you're comfortable doing self-builds it would probably work out a lot cheaper in the long run.

• The Antec 300 - as mentioned - is a solid bet as it has space for 6 HDDs and is from a reliable manufacturer.
• You can get 2TB HDDs, but it might be worth waiting and reading up on them as data is packed so tightly that sometimes they're a little buggy (my Hitachi used to keep finding orphaned files, which seems to have resolved itself now that theres some more stuff on it, weirdly). Also, as someone else mentioned, using slower RPM drives would generate less heat. Something like a 5400 might work well.
• Something like a Corsair 450W PSU would be a reliable bet, and can supply the power to all 6 drives.
• Gigabyte and Asus are the standard "go to" for Motherboards. Maybe something like a P45 UD3 Gigabyte? Again, you can plug in all 6 SATA HDDs at the same time, and it can take an intel Core 2 Duo which should be fine for processing purposes, and is generally pretty good heat wise (else so many laptops wouldn't use them). You may like the look of the new i-range of processors, but power efficient they ain't. Also, it uses DDR2 which is now cheap as anything.

You can skip the graphics card, you should run fine without one. As for RAID, I plead ignorant here. Since most of these components are being phased out you should be able to pick them up fairly cheaply; $40 for the case, $200 for a couple of 2TB HDDs, maybe $40 again for PSU and $150 for the mobo/processor. $450 total, with plenty of room to upgrade to 12TB should you need to. This is just intended as a guideline to get you started, I'd do my research before pencilling anything in; look up some benchmarks on tomshardware.com and see if you can find any reliable info on how well the Antec300 manages to cool things down.

[TorturdChaos]

The Antec 300 - as mentioned - is a solid bet as it has space for 6 HDDs and is from a reliable manufacturer.[/li][/list]

I have the Antec 300 Illusion case for my main computer.  Only difference between it and the regular 300 is the Illusion comes with 2 fans in the front
I have to say I am very happy with it for a case.  Came with a crap load of screws, and even more thumb screws. And the front comes off very easily to clean the filter.
I have 3 hard drives in it so far, and could easily put 3 more hard drives in it.

[Pentium100]

For $2k you can grab an older server and some hard drives. You would get the nice features of a server, such as redundant power supplies, hot swap fans etc. Those things are built to last, but are expensive when new. Just find one that has a SATA or SAS controller instead of SCSI. SAS controller works with SATA drives.

Anyway, as for cases - I like rackmount cases, saves space (you can put something on it), does not require long cables, has quite good cooling and last but not least, it is easier to access when I want to replace some part.

[datora]

.
Sorry I missed a couple of the clues. 

So, your budget is pretty substantial.  You should be able to do a lot with it.  Your tech skillz & desire to spend time building & configuring are now one trade-off against available funds.

The OS question relates to cost and performance.  Cost not an issue as you have Win 7 license.  If you know linux, you can setup a pretty lean server on lower end hardware, saving some $$s.  I'm still too n00b @linux right now to offer serious support that way, just pointing it out.  There are at least a dozen fairly main-stream distros that'll take care of your needs.

I'll go with the other recommendations here as far as low-cost server box.  I'd think you can get far more power than you can possibly need for ~$400 or so.  Your needs are pretty slim, so a 2x core AMD of some sort and 4GB RAM should do you fine, which you can build from a PC kit.

I use newegg as a place to start, and rarely can beat their deals.  So, that's where I pull examples from when I'm going fast; it's by no means my recommendation not to look around & see if you can do better.


Something like this could do you, and a very comfortable margin more powerful than you need:

 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboBundleDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.472937

Mobo is excellent, processor is overpowered, case would accommodate at least six drives, PSU is a bit lean for four or six drives, though; might be looking at upgrading that into the ~600W range.

You could put 4 drives in this and then get a 4-drive NAS that connects by USB 3 or eSATA or get a Gbit NIC

This build combo:

 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboBundleDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.472963

is very similar.  Processor is 2x core, but hyperthreaded to simulate 4.  700W power supply is more interesting.  Mobo less exciting, you lose the USB 3 & eSATA options & get fewer expansion slots to play with.

Compare those to something prebuilt:

 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16859105777


Anyway, you're under $500 & you've got the base system built.  The AMD option is powerful enough to install linux & run a virtualization or two of WinXP or Win7 if you wish.  Also, it's more PC=like with graphics & whatnot, so you can access & manage it more like logging into a remote PC than getting stuck at a command line or crippled GUI.  Maybe that offers some flexibility you can use.


Now you're looking at drives.

Unfortunately, since this morning newegg has finished with their promotion of Western Digital 2TB Caviar Black drives.  They were $150 each, so you could of had four (8TB) for $600.  For a couple more days you can still get them for $180 using a promo code:

 - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136456

Normally I'd steer clear of 2TB drives, but I'd be willing to place a bet on the Caviar Black series.  Of course there are many other options, as some have been mentioned.  The Eco & Green drives by several manufacturers give me a Not So Good feeling ... Seen a lot of hard luck stories with those over the past 4 - 6 months.

A possibility here is get one performance drive to run the OS on, possibly even grabbing a 60GB or 64GB  SSD and then RAID four 1.5TB or 2TB drives.  Even with a board that has SATA 6GB/s native, you really only need the 3 GB/s drives for what you want.


Figure you'll probably find another ~$150 in misc support hardware (like a couple of ultra-silent fans, a Gbit router, 100' of CAT 6 cable), you could be in for an 8TB solution @~$1400, or even a good bit under if you go with 1.5TB or even 1TB drives to begin.

Get all that running properly and you could then add a NAS solution direct to the server over RJ45, eSATA 6 or USB 3 a month or four down the line for ~$600-$800 and you'll be right near your budget limit and be rolling with 12TB (minimum) or maybe up to 16TB.

Actually, though, don't forget you'll want substantial surge protection & UPS to protect everything, so you'll probably be looking $100 up to $200 for one of those depending on power & features.

And, of course, upthread are several suggestion where costs could be trimmed.  You might be able to come in the ~$1500-$1600 range when it's all done.

[rostheferret]

For $2k you can grab an older server and some hard drives.

For $2K you could build a high-end gaming rig from scratch and STILL find 4TB storage space

[vuzedome]

Oh come on, they guys gonna build one that can easily be expanded, mini servers don't come cheap, even htpcs don't come cheap as well.

[bork]

My system I am currently using as a storage system currently uses a 1 GHz P4 on a Abits mother board, it was something I had laying around.  Runs BSD as the OS and SAMBA to allow access from Windows.  The chassis, power supply,  Sata controller, and disk drives are the new stuff.  It handles 6 TB of storage with no problems, just sits in its little corner doing its thing.

Cost:
mother board - $0 (existing)
Case - $45 (on sale)
Power Supply - $120
2 SATA controllers - $90
4 Disks - ~$500
Total - $755

I have thought about getting a newer mother board and processor for it but it has not become a priority.  The problems that I have run into because its a older mother board is it gets a bit confused with the newer SATA controllers and number of disks, has problems on finding the boot drive.  I have to play around on which drive is on which controller and the channel on it.