Author Topic: Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.  (Read 3358 times)

Offline kitamesume

  • Member
  • Posts: 7223
  • Death is pleasure, Living is torment.
Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« on: August 23, 2011, 03:19:52 PM »


Quote
SDXC - Secure Digital eXtended Capacity
Recently, the SD Association announced the choice for exFAT, a standardized division that is supported by Windows VISTA and also works with Windows XP, CE and the future Windows 7 operating system. We have yet to see which hardware will be the first on the market supporting this new SDCX format. High Definition camcorders are very likely to be the first, while this type of equipment requires large storage capacities. In addition to expanding the amount of GBs to an impressive maximum of 2TB (Terabyte), speed is equally important. Where a maximum speed of 25MB/sec is reached, it will reach an astonishing 100 to 300MB/sec after the increase of bus speed by 50.
http://www.letsgodigital.org/en/21575/sdxc/

its an old story... but its tiny, stacking a few of them would result to a matchbox size terabyte storage.

makes me wonder why they couldn't design SSDs to be this tiny.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2011, 03:52:22 PM by kitamesume »

Haruhi Dance | EMO | OLD SETs | ^ I know how u feel | Click sig to Enlarge

Offline Freedom Kira

  • Member
  • Posts: 4324
  • Rawr™.
Re: Stacking Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2011, 04:02:22 PM »
Because a) that small size isn't really necessary (and actually there was an article last year about Samsung Sandisk creating a tiny SSD (called iSSD) intended for use with ultramobile devices); note that SSDs tend to be 2.5" because they fit in laptops that way, and b) that's a ridiculously expensive idea. A 32GB MicroSDHC card costs roughly $70 these days. As you increase the space into SDXC capacities, the cost increases exponentially. A good 40GB SSD costs about $100 now and prices are expected to drop significantly in 2012.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2011, 09:08:40 PM by Freedom Kira »

Offline kitamesume

  • Member
  • Posts: 7223
  • Death is pleasure, Living is torment.
Re: Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2011, 04:25:35 PM »
^true, well the 2TB versions of the SDXC arent out yet either. but i think they`ll bring the prices down as well, seeing a 2TB @ 600$++ would just be rediculous, and as the article says, it should have a 300MB/s speed so speed wouldn't be an issue.

64GB SDXC is at 115$ right now on newegg.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2011, 04:27:43 PM by kitamesume »

Haruhi Dance | EMO | OLD SETs | ^ I know how u feel | Click sig to Enlarge

Offline AnimeJanai

  • Member
  • Posts: 2474
  • http://anonym.to/?
    • Doujinshi Database & Lexicon
Re: Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2011, 11:36:40 PM »
If you stack them up to fit in a "matchbox", don't you have to worry about heat?  If regular use didn't make enough heat, but cyclic use like in a memory thrashing program did that, then technically, use of the stacked SDXC "matchbox" would make an exploit possible.  A program could be made that accesses only the memory addresses of the chips located in the middle to generate heat to attempt burning up some memory.

Offline kitamesume

  • Member
  • Posts: 7223
  • Death is pleasure, Living is torment.
Re: Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2011, 03:55:00 AM »
well it is possible to mount them on a flat heatsink, that should spread the heat. just like making a sandwich.

Haruhi Dance | EMO | OLD SETs | ^ I know how u feel | Click sig to Enlarge

Offline tomoya-kun

  • Member
  • Posts: 6374
  • Reporting for duty.
Re: Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2011, 07:49:49 AM »
I'm guessing it would be slower as well as those cards are generally slower than SSDs


BBT Team Riko Suminoe #000002

Offline kureshii

  • Former Staff
  • Member
  • Posts: 4485
  • May typeset edited light novels if asked nicely.
Re: Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2011, 09:03:09 AM »
Actual vs max performance
That article is misleading. SDXC transfer bandwidth under SD 3.0 is rated at 832 Mbps max. 2.4 Gbps (~300MB/s) is the stated maximum under SD 4.0 spec. What you actually get out of your SD card is likely to be much lower than that. considering that SD 2.0 defines transfer speeds up to 200× (30MB/s) yet we get much lower speeds than that with most SD cards, I doubt we’ll see that increased interface bandwidth put to much use. Likewise, that 2TB is stated maximum capacity; it doesnt mean we’ll see 2TB SDXC cards at launch! (good luck on expecting 3D-fabbed or <10nm NAND flash in the consumer market within the next year) The 32GB limit of SDHC was an artificially imposed limit anyway, and one can find non-compliant SD cards with more storage than that; the sector addressing used in SDHC allows addressing up to 2TB of storage after all.

Multi-SD SATA devices in the market
Using multiple SD cards as SSDs is not a new idea. I make no comments on the prices of those devices, but keep in mind that a storage controller which can give you speeds commensurate with a proper SSD is going to cost you as well.

Capacity, longevity and performance
NAND prices aren't going to plummet just because consumers expect them to, although going by industry forecasts we can expect a steady drop. 2TB of NAND flash is not going to be as cheap as you expect. Your average 32GB SDHC runs for about $1/GB, and we’re talking about a Class 6 device, not even anywhere near SSD performance if you throw 4 of them in an enclosure with a JBOD/RAID controller.

What kind of performance difference are we talking? Below are some benchmark charts tested over USB 2.0. (I was lazy to dig into my desktop for a SATA connection, and besides this gives you an idea of what each can achieve over the same interface. Note that in practical use, one would typically see no more than 35MB/s with removable storage over a USB 2.0 interface.)

SD Card (Sandisk 2GB ExtremeIII, pretty good by SD card standards)





SSD (OCZ 30GB Core V2 — Note that this is an old, shitty SSD without TRIM and does not represent typical performance of reviewed SSDs)



(click to show/hide)

The lower latency of the SSD is noteworthy. At the time of writing, a 32GB ExtremeIII SD Card costs ~$75, an Intel 40GB X25-V (which does much better than the Core V2 and has TRIM) goes for ~$90, and a 1TB 2.5" hard drive can be had for $100 or less (all US prices). The potential price of a stacked SD storage device does not seem very compelling for the form factor it is going to occupy or the performance it will display.

Add to this the fact that a good SSD comes with firmware that can lower write amplification by optimising write operations and doing wear-levelling, thus increasing the longevity of the drive. Unless this SD-stacking device also has such firmware (i.e. most likely with a pricey controller), you might see those 5,000–10,000 write cycles quickly eaten away on one or more SD devices, instead of being evenly spread out.

Even if we assume similar write amplification on both devices, SD products typically use 3-bit-per-cell MLC technology, which though cheaper and denser (storage-wise) than 2-bit-per-cell MLC, also has lower performance and longevity. That is how we manage to cram 32GB into microSD form factor. Keep that in mind when you note the size of the NAND packages on SSDs. In any case, 3-bit-per-cell MLC is typically used for cheaper and smaller storage products such as USB flash drives, SD cards, CF cards and other similar flash storage devices, where one does not expect heavy, frequent or large writes. Cramming many such devices into a heavier-use storage device without wear-levelling and write-amplification-optimising algorithms is just asking for trouble.

What such a device might look like
My prediction: By the time someone comes up with a “stacked micro-SDXC ultra-compact storage drive”, it’s going to look a lot like this:



… Guess what that is?
« Last Edit: September 08, 2011, 06:37:49 AM by kureshii »

Online Mistgun_Zero

  • Member
  • Posts: 4276
  • Idol~chan
Re: Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2011, 11:09:20 AM »
Kureshii, you outdid yourself on this one, anyway no I don't know what that is and would like to know.

Offline kureshii

  • Former Staff
  • Member
  • Posts: 4485
  • May typeset edited light novels if asked nicely.
Re: Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2011, 11:40:08 AM »
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4606/samsung-announces-pm830-its-first-6gbps-ssd-with-up-to-512gb-capacities

Just a PCB shot of yet another SSD. Which are essentially high-performance NAND flash storage devices, very similar to the idea of a “stacked Micro-SDXC ultra compact storage drive”. If you want them any more compact, they come in 1.8" form factor as well, and for even more compact form factors, SATA-IO just announced the µSATA standard, which allows OEMs to embed the storage device directly in a BGA package. This is meant for embedded products, and you can’t really go much more compact than that. I guess this would be the ultra-compact SSD you’re looking for, except it won’t be easily removable from the device it’s soldered onto.

As for cheap, lower-performance 1TB SSDs … might as well just buy a platter-based HDD instead. NAND flash isn't likely to beat them for price/GB within the next year or so (if we’re talking about consumer devices).
« Last Edit: August 24, 2011, 12:21:25 PM by kureshii »

Offline AnimeJanai

  • Member
  • Posts: 2474
  • http://anonym.to/?
    • Doujinshi Database & Lexicon
Re: Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2011, 05:32:43 PM »
I'd rather wait for DRAM to keep dropping.  I've always wanted a DRAM drive.  Upon bootup or shutdown, the data in the DRAM is copied to/from either a hard drive or flash memory for longterm storage.  To cover for power dropout, a tantalum capacitor supplies enough power to save data.   A DRAM drive would be the fastest and have no worries about wearing out any flash cells.  It can also be used for tasks that have a lot of churning writes which causes flash drives to wear out prematurely.

Offline kitamesume

  • Member
  • Posts: 7223
  • Death is pleasure, Living is torment.
Re: Stacking 64GB-2TB Micro-SDXC for ultra compact storage drive.
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2011, 07:16:50 PM »
^ if its speed then that should be the fastest, plus DDR3's price is dropping way too fast... 10$ for 2gig anyone?

if its price then stacking HDDs should be the cheapest.

if its physical size then Micro-SDXC... lets just wait and see how much a 2TB micro-SDXC costs if its practical or not.

Haruhi Dance | EMO | OLD SETs | ^ I know how u feel | Click sig to Enlarge