ISP Bandwidth Limits

[TMRNetShark]

Yeah the U.S. is seriously dropping the ball when it comes to broadband.
When I was in Japan 10 years ago we got what the average American citizen gets today (which is around 10meg). And Europe practically mandates that their people get good service.  This chart pretty much says it all.

That being said, I recently upgraded my service to 60/6 and it's pretty descent. Cost me $100/month. Got a 500gb monthly cap but I've been breaking it a lot and they haven't cut me off yet. Keeping my fingers crossed though.

Looked into the business service. It's almost double the money for the same speed. No caps though.

Japan is about 145,882 square miles. USA is about 3,794,083 square miles. Once again, South Korea is 38486 square miles. Why some smaller countries have amazing internet speed versus even smaller countries having terrible speed is all about infrastructure. Do countries lower on the speed list have less demand for internet? Hell no... do countries with higher bandwidth speeds use 100% of the bandwidth? I certainly don't use all of my 20 Mb/s 90% of the time. I don't care how big my connection is (although, it is important), it isn't as important as the SPEED (or ping/latency). Some people have terrible latency issues in Canada or AUS/NZ. Why? Infrastructure.

[karakurared]

That's a good point about the size difference impacting the infrastructure. And they only have half the population of the U.S. so that help them out too.

But I think the point being made by the others was that there is a price/performance disparity. While what you say is indeed true, the sheer cost of broadband vs. the performance Americans get leaves much to be desired.
I pay about $100 for 60mb service.
My friend in Japan pays $60 for 160mb service.
I would call this a substantial difference 

And I'm pretty sure that the stats on that chart only take the average of people who actually buy broadband service so it's not like millions of people contribute zeros to the equation. (haven't confirmed that)

[TMRNetShark]

That's a good point about the size difference impacting the infrastructure. And they only have half the population of the U.S. so that help them out too.

But I think the point being made by the others was that there is a price/performance disparity. While what you say is indeed true, the sheer cost of broadband vs. the performance Americans get leaves much to be desired.
I pay about $100 for 60mb service.
My friend in Japan pays $60 for 160mb service.
I would call this a substantial difference 

And I'm pretty sure that the stats on that chart only take the average of people who actually buy broadband service so it's not like millions of people contribute zeros to the equation. (haven't confirmed that)

It probably doesn't add people without broadband/no internet at all. Seriously though? The average in the USA isn't even up to 10 Mb/s? I've had 17-20 Mb/s for at least 3 years now. The only thing is, I live on the east coast. Comparatively speaking, I'm within 175 miles of 4 major cities (Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington DC, and New York)... There is also a much greater concentration of suburbs and rural areas that constitute a higher population per square mile of the east coast. In lame terms, there is a lot of people spread out among east coast, and infrastructure to handle the internet load is easily made (Verizon proved that point quite easily around here). Don't have internet infrastructure in your rural house? Verizon will lay down infrastructure to get service to your house within 2 weeks... and all you pay for is the installation at your house (or free if they are running a promotion). So think of the east coast as a big "web" of inter-connected internet pipelines connecting major areas together.

Then take a look at the West coast. There is LA, San Diego, San Fransisco,  Las Vegas, Denver, and all the other major cities. There isn't much need for sprawling infrastructure between each city... so there is maybe 2-3 major dedicated pipelines of intrawebs connecting each city to create it's "larger" web. Then again, the choices of ISPs is limited anywhere you are in the USA. I'm sure that since Japan is a very geographically tiny country (with well over 1/3 of the USA's population), it is able to lay down the infrastructure relatively fast and cheaply (because they probably manufacture all the equipment, routing boxes, cable/fiber optics lines) all right there in the country. Not only that, but there is probably massive competition between each ISP in Japan... which is probably why it's cheaper and faster.

On a side note... Japan probably has massively cheaper cell phone data plans than in the USA. There is only REALLY a choice between 4 companies. The 2 bigger companies (ATT and Verizon) both impose a data limit each month (before the rise of the smart phones, data was unlimited). So not only is competition thriving in Japan, but it's good for the end user because the Japan people probably get the best quality internet/cell service in the world. Why? Small country = less area to cover for infrastructure... meaning better quality infrastructure per square mile (for both internet and cell service).

Then again, there is a "Sunlight" tax in Tokyo. 

[karakurared]

rofl at the sunlight tax  

And yeah I didn't even think about wireless. Things have changed so much since I moved so I can't really say much about it.

Speaking of wireless... I recent got on the 4gLTE network with Verizon, and just in time to get unlimited data plan  
I'm not sure how it compared to Japan's wireless but it's pretty frickin' sweet!! I grabbed the latest Nichijou episode while I was away from the house and that downloaded at a pretty steady 2000k. Dunno if I could get it faster with more seeds, but whatever I'm happy with what I get.

So do you guys get FIOS over there in the south west?

Edit: East coast I mean... was reading about L.A. while typing 

[Stsin]

Why US broadband sucks hard:

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=competition-and-the-internet
http://www.engadget.com/2011/06/28/why-is-european-broadband-faster-and-cheaper-blame-the-governme/
http://corp.sonic.net/ceo/2011/03/05/why-us-broadband-is-so-slow/

It's due to lack of competition that the govt forced upon us.  I'm sure some representatives are wealthier now after removing shared access to essential fiber infrastructure for competitive carriers.

I've once said that a project that the fed can do to create jobs, is to help lay down the fibre infrastructure so that we don't get passed up by 3rd world countries.  But what's the point, when it can't be shared with other competitors?

No matter how large our country is, saying we can't do the same as Italy or any other country that have upgraded overnight, is pure BS.  It's like saying it's difficult to supply water or electricity to rural areas....and totally ignoring the ease of doing it in the metropolitan areas.  So why does our metropolitan areas sucks so hard?

[TMRNetShark]

Why US broadband sucks hard:

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=competition-and-the-internet
http://www.engadget.com/2011/06/28/why-is-european-broadband-faster-and-cheaper-blame-the-governme/
http://corp.sonic.net/ceo/2011/03/05/why-us-broadband-is-so-slow/

It's due to lack of competition that the govt forced upon us.  I'm sure some representatives are wealthier now after removing shared access to essential fiber infrastructure for competitive carriers.

I've once said that a project that the fed can do to create jobs, is to help lay down the fibre infrastructure so that we don't get passed up by 3rd world countries.  But what's the point, when it can't be shared with other competitors?

No matter how large our country is, saying we can't do the same as Italy or any other country that have upgraded overnight, is pure BS.  It's like saying it's difficult to supply water or electricity to rural areas....and totally ignoring the ease of doing it in the metropolitan areas.  So why does our metropolitan areas sucks so hard?

Cause we need bigger tubes.

[Tatsujin]

Lets just all of us move to Japan. Problems solved.

[TMRNetShark]

Lets just all of us move to Japan. Problems solved.

All in favor, say "aye!"

We can all just use clips from animes we watch to communicate with people until we can all learn Japanese ourselves.

[tomoya-kun]

That chart up there, I think is wrong.  Canada definitely has slower internet than United States.

[NaRu]

Lets just all of us move to Japan. Problems solved.

The laws for illegal downloads in japan is worse then the US. So if you plan to download anime in Japan you have a better chance of getting caught. Not 100 percent sure this is true but a friend that lives in Japan (US Air Force Base) told me about that.

[Tatsujin]

Lets just all of us move to Japan. Problems solved.

The laws for illegal downloads in japan is worse then the US. So if you plan to download anime in Japan you have a better chance of getting caught. Not 100 percent sure this is true but a friend that lives in Japan (US Air Force Base) told me about that.

That's actually true. I have several friends in Japan - which now I only keep in contact with one - they told me they can't download anime since they can get caught. The chances are low generally, but higher than in the United States. It's even worse if you download programs and Visual Novels.

[Spanks]

Lets just all of us move to Japan. Problems solved.

Come live in Australia, no one gives a shit about us down here. I have yet to see as article about an Australian being sent to court for illegally downloading lately (I'm sure someone has but)

[Tatsujin]

Lets just all of us move to Japan. Problems solved.

Come live in Australia, no one gives a shit about us down here. I have yet to see as article about an Australian being sent to court for illegally downloading lately (I'm sure someone has but)

You guys haven't fell off the face of the Earth. How the hell are you guys hanging down there? (just joking lol) <3 Move out of Australia?

[Spanks]

Lets just all of us move to Japan. Problems solved.

Come live in Australia, no one gives a shit about us down here. I have yet to see as article about an Australian being sent to court for illegally downloading lately (I'm sure someone has but)

You guys haven't fell off the face of the Earth. How the hell are you guys hanging down there? (just joking lol) <3 Move out of Australia?

I plan too, great place to live but boring as ^%*#. I'm also bored of living with overly content, secretly racist bogans.

I will admit I am worried if I ever live in Japan with what you guys and other have said about downloading. Though I should have enough anime to last me a lifetime before I leave and steam has made illegally downloading games a waste of time.

Hmm I wonder if they check your hard drives as you enter Japan. "Excuse me sir do you have any illegal anime to declare"

[Freedom Kira]

I will admit I am worried if I ever live in Japan with what you guys and other have said about downloading. Though I should have enough anime to last me a lifetime before I leave and steam has made illegally downloading games a waste of time.

Hmm I wonder if they check your hard drives as you enter Japan. "Excuse me sir do you have any illegal anime to declare"

It'd be nice if you could get any Japanese games, especially visual novels, off of Steam.

[ColdFission]

Canada overall is pretty piss poor for broadband access. The big guys, Bell, Telus (West), and Rogers (East) have monopolies here in Canada. Its really hard to find competitive pricing without the bulcrap bandwidth caps with outrageous over-usage fees. If you are lucky, then you can go with some 2nd or 3rd tier ISPs that basically pay for the last mile from the larger ISPs and then bill you for that (as well as billings for their own internal networks). I am with a small ISP called Delta Cable which is now owned by EastLink which is based in Nova Scotia. Currently, we are in a bundle for Digital TV, phone, and Internet access for around $120.00 a month (I think that is the price, but that is what the Delta Cable site is telling but I don't currently have their Internet 40 plan but when you bundle it, caps do not apply to Internet 40 in this bundle. Normally, the cap is 250 GB a month for their Internet 40 {no bundle} and Internet 100 plans). As for the broadband access itself, I am currently on their Internet 20 (with the bundle) so up to 20 mb/s down and .9 mb/s, no caps. This month I've gone through 1.25 TB according to Bandwidth Monitor Pro (a really great to monitor your usage). I might call them up to see if I can get Internet 40 since we are already in their 3 product bundle for no extra charge. That would be great if I could since my uploads are really sad (sorry guys, I am trying!! xD)

There was an online petition called StopTheMeter where nearly 500,000 Canadians signed. The petition was help by openmedia.ca and it is a really good place to keep taps on news relating to Canadian Internet and content access. Michael Geist (michaelgeist.com) is also a great source that cover these issues along with copyright stuff.

So yeah, UBB (usage based billing) is really just a money grab by the ISPs. You can't compare Internet access to natural gas which is based on how much you use because its not a renewal resource and it is actually "used". You can't run out of "Internet" access because its always there.

The big thing in Canada right now that is being covered by openemdia (and others) are warrant-less taps on ISP customers by the RCMP. Its a measure that is included Harper's mega crime bill that is going to be voted on soon by the Parliament.

http://goo.gl/x4JT5

Anyway, I'd like to leave some links that covers the UBB issue:
http://goo.gl/5TDd4 UBB deception series
http://wordsbynowak.com/2011/02/22/10-myths-from-usage-based-billing-supporters/
http://dwmw.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/st-arnaud-myths-and-facts-re-ubb.pdf


EDIT: I just called my ISP and they said they will be doing rolling upgrades for customers in my area within this month or the next for free upgrade to Internet 40 (although she did mention that its happening already). This is great because for one, its going to be free; second, no caps with the bundle; and higher upload speeds of up to 2 mb/s, which means better seeding and faster uploads of photos and videos to Facebook (well, more of and advantage to my dad my brother who use it more than I do, especially for my dad since he uploads HD video to his account). Problem is that I need to upgrade my current Motorola Surfboard SB5101 DOCSIS 2.0 modem to the Motorola Surfboard SBG6580 DOCSIS 3.0 Wireless Gateway cable modem to get those speeds. Might have to call in some installers to come in sometime to switch out the modem.

[karakurared]

I will admit I am worried if I ever live in Japan with what you guys and other have said about downloading. Though I should have enough anime to last me a lifetime before I leave and steam has made illegally downloading games a waste of time.

Hmm I wonder if they check your hard drives as you enter Japan. "Excuse me sir do you have any illegal anime to declare"

It'd be nice if you could get any Japanese games, especially visual novels, off of Steam.

Hell yes it would. I just had to import Haruhi for the PS3 and that was way too expensive.
Steam + Japanese games = WIN

[Freedom Kira]

ColdFission - you must be living in Eastern Canada. Over here in the West is a company called Shaw. They rolled out upgrades to their network starting in the middle of the summer and are continuing to upgrade AFAIK; the weakest new plan was a 50/3 that would be upgraded to 50/5 by the end of the year. Their upgrades are due mostly to the phasing out of analog.

Shaw made a good impression on me by holding a few UBB discussion meetings and deciding to remove their proposed UBB schemes shortly before the OpenMedia success. In addition to that, I'm a student, so I get some intense discounts.

Now, I really hope OpenMedia can hang on to that momentum and kill that stupid online spying bill, which worries me a heck of a lot more than UBB. UBB is money-gouging, but spying is a direct infringement on the basic human right to privacy.

Stupid Conservatives. Why do people in this country keep voting for them?!

[ColdFission]

ColdFission - you must be living in Eastern Canada. Over here in the West is a company called Shaw. They rolled out upgrades to their network starting in the middle of the summer and are continuing to upgrade AFAIK; the weakest new plan was a 50/3 that would be upgraded to 50/5 by the end of the year. Their upgrades are due mostly to the phasing out of analog.

Shaw made a good impression on me by holding a few UBB discussion meetings and deciding to remove their proposed UBB schemes shortly before the OpenMedia success. In addition to that, I'm a student, so I get some intense discounts.

Now, I really hope OpenMedia can hang on to that momentum and kill that stupid online spying bill, which worries me a heck of a lot more than UBB. UBB is money-gouging, but spying is a direct infringement on the basic human right to privacy.

Stupid Conservatives. Why do people in this country keep voting for them?!

Hehehe, I am a British Columbian (formerly a Manitoban from Winterpeg) living in the Lower Mainland. Delta is the municipality where I reside at currently, hence the name "Delta Cable". Our services were actually cut a few weeks ago because a few hooligans decided to cute some copper and some fiber for some quick cash, no one has yet to be arrested though. I am actually happy with my Internet connection (minus the really crappy up speeds right now of less than 1 Mb/s although I still manage with seeding and all that) and will be more happy once I get the free upgrade from 20 Mb/s down to 40 Mb/s down with up to 2 Mb/s up. IIRC, Shaw still has monthly caps and that is personally a deal breaker for now that I am nearing or going over 1 TB of usage a month now and I don't want to to get dinged with $1-2 for every 1 GB that I go over.

And as for the current government, I was glad I voted against them (and for the first time voting for any level of government) and went with the NDP. Harper and his gang of goonies are really good at manipulating the Canadian public which are mostly seniors now and are easily swayed to vote for him with fancy scare tactics and the like. I never liked the guy when he came into power during the minority government years and I just hate the guy even more.


PS: It was a really sad day for everyone when Jack Layton passed away of what seemed just days after gaining the official opposition position in Parliament. Big respect for him, terrible he didn't live longer to maybe get that big chair down in Ottawa.

[Freedom Kira]

Not to go political here, but yeah I voted NDP too.

Anyway, back to Internet. Shaw actually does not enforce its caps. With their new system, users on their older plans (High Speed Lite, High Speed, High Speed Extreme) have caps that they don't charge you for going over, but they will call you and bug you if you do it frequently.

With their Broadband plans, they use the bump-up program, in which you are bumped up to the next tier of Internet with higher speed and caps (and higher cost, like $10 more per level; the highest level has no caps but costs $120/mo IIRC) for the rest of the month if you do go over. I believe you do get a warning message before you go over, though.

Go read their website again. It's a nice system they put in. The $1-2/extra GB was months ago.