Author Topic: Ghost Love? (Read 2508 times)

Raylightsa3 · « **Reply #20 on:** March 30, 2012, 12:29:55 AM »

so much for life is great ha people like you are the kind that make me sick and you wonder why I feel the world is fucked up if you dont have any real interest in this topic and your not going to take this seriously then fuck off and stop wasting my time.

elvikun · « **Reply #21 on:** March 30, 2012, 12:53:43 AM »

I merely offer a rational explanation, I am but a skeptical person, with an interest in all discussions supernatural, extraterrestrial and religious.

Life is such as it is, but in this case as in many others...
Bring a group of people believeing in aliens and show them the light in the sky, they will tell you it's alien craft, but bring a group of people with no interest in the subject and they will tell you the light is a storm comming. Show broken glass of ketchup to furious christians and they will see a face of Maria or Jesus on the floor, where group of non-religious people will only see a mess on the floor. Those people do not lie about the signs, they do believe they see them because the want to see them. Such is the power of suggestion and even more so, self-suggestion.

And as you probably guessed the same goes with supernatural - Just because more than one person says there is a ghost, it does not mean there really is a ghost, especially not if all people present and very interested and believe in supernatural beings.

Objects are moving by themselves all the time, yet it never happens with camera present - trully, we could go into the infamous "Spaghetti monster" argument here.

If you really find doubt to be offensive, you should've keep it all to yourself and never speak of it with anyone.

Nikkoru · « **Reply #22 on:** March 30, 2012, 12:59:17 AM »

Raylightsa3 · « **Reply #23 on:** March 30, 2012, 01:18:28 AM »

Quote from: elvikun on March 30, 2012, 12:53:43 AM

I merely offer a rational explanation, I am but a skeptical person, with an interest in all discussions supernatural, extraterrestrial and religious.

Life is such as it is, but in this case as in many others...
Bring a group of people believeing in aliens and show them the light in the sky, they will tell you it's alien craft, but bring a group of people with no interest in the subject and they will tell you the light is a storm comming. Show broken glass of ketchup to furious christians and they will see a face of Maria or Jesus on the floor, where group of non-religious people will only see a mess on the floor. Those people do not lie about the signs, they do believe they see them because the want to see them. Such is the power of suggestion and even more so, self-suggestion.

And as you probably guessed the same goes with supernatural - Just because more than one person says there is a ghost, it does not mean there really is a ghost, especially not if all people present and very interested and believe in supernatural beings.

Objects are moving by themselves all the time, yet it never happens with camera present - trully, we could go into the infamous "Spaghetti monster" argument here.

If you really find doubt to be offensive, you should've keep it all to yourself and never speak of it with anyone.

its not doubt its the shity comments allot of you on here make that is in no way an opinion but an insult i post this because I think its interesting and maybe someone els will take interest i dont post it to be ridiculed

Soryon · « **Reply #24 on:** March 30, 2012, 01:27:22 AM »

Next time I get abducted by aliens (which happens all the time, mind you.. I just cant get it to happen any time someone is there to witness it) I will have them drop me off at your house so we can watch for the ghosts together.

elvikun · « **Reply #25 on:** March 30, 2012, 01:30:57 AM »

Quote from: Raylightsa3 on March 30, 2012, 01:18:28 AM

its not doubt its the shity comments allot of you on here make that is in no way an opinion but an insult i post this because I think its interesting and maybe someone els will take interest i dont post it to be ridiculed

In all honesty, I wasn't ridiculing you, I was seriously just discussing. And mind you the part about ancestors tearing their beards off wasn't meant for you.

If you check the last post, the part above the doubt, then you see what my point is.

AceHigh · « **Reply #26 on:** March 30, 2012, 01:31:17 AM »

Quote from: Raylightsa3 on March 30, 2012, 01:18:28 AM

its not doubt its the shity comments allot of you on here make that is in no way an opinion but an insult i post this because I think its interesting and maybe someone els will take interest i dont post it to be ridiculed

You misunderstand. We would make vulgar sex jokes even if it wasn't a ghost, but a living human girl stalking you. If you want to avoid that, you should have thought of a more appropriate title for this thread.

Raylightsa3 · « **Reply #27 on:** March 30, 2012, 01:38:14 AM »

sorry i do tend to snap easily and im a bit slow at catching on to jokes thats my disability aspergers syndrome. but I thought the sex joke was said to humiliate me sorry soryon and elvikun my bad i would have edited my post but it was to late before i realized it was a joke

Ixarku · « **Reply #28 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:00:39 AM »

Even though I'm an atheist, I'm undecided about the existence of ghosts. The skeptic in me puts the likelihood of people truly encountering ghosts at just slightly greater than the chance of an encounter with real aliens. (Actually, I think alien encounters haven't occurred at all in human history.) Almost every EVP I've ever heard is IMO either a hoax or just noise that someone is mistakenly interpreting as a voice. The evidence I do think it pretty cool is seeing objects moving around by themselves on camera, although again that kind of stuff can be faked too and there's nothing that proves the cause is really a ghost or spirit of some sort. So I'm open to the idea of ghosts, but I would probably have to personally experience something really unusual before I'd be willing to make the jump to belief.

Raylightsa3 · « **Reply #29 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:04:40 AM »

thats how I was before this happend

elvikun · « **Reply #30 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:13:28 AM »

@Ixarku

Well, that was kind of my point. For -some- reason, the trully skeptical people seem to never experience miracles, aliens or ghost encounters. Those who do, alway, and I mean always have some previous interest in the matter. And that is why I call it the power of suggestion.

The last ghost I met in 250 yers old house was a mice which found a way to a spacet bellow the floor in the dark and creepy attic room. Surprisingly enough, it got quite a few people spooked. Scrathing and crubling sounds from the attic everynight, yet nothing in the room and silence as soon as anyone approached the door. That was untill I caught the mice and shipped her to nearby forest.

Raylightsa3 · « **Reply #31 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:17:32 AM »

My interpolation of what you said is our imagination taking physical form or projecting itself into a form of energy making these phenomena happen. but I could be wrong but this is how i perceive your power of suggestion

Soryon · « **Reply #32 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:18:51 AM »

I think of ghosts in much the same way as I think of Gods or other religious idols, such as Jesus, etc. After all, its called the Holy Ghost, right? Yea, thats two reasons not to believe in that one...

Something that has never been proven with any more proof then any modern day religious nut who claims to have talked with their god, saw him in a cloud or on a piece of toast. I don't doubt many people actually believe in their experiences and think they hold some deep meanings, but them being adamant about their experiences is not proof, not even close. If you cant come up with anything more then your word, then I won't ever see you as anything but either an overzealous nut or someone who perhaps has a chemical imbalance.

(click to show/hide)

megido-rev.M · « **Reply #33 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:24:55 AM »

I would just say it's an illusion.

Raylightsa3 · « **Reply #34 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:25:35 AM »

if people think this way or that way thats fine with me just as long as they dont judge me or condemn me with it

elvikun · « **Reply #35 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:28:55 AM »

Quote from: Raylightsa3 on March 30, 2012, 02:17:32 AM

My interpolation of what you said is our imagination taking physical form or projecting itself into a form of energy making these phenomena happen. but I could be wrong but this is how i perceive your power of suggestion

As in when enough people believe in god, god will come to be? No.
That is not what I meant.

What I meant is that you can make yourself (even not on puprpose) believe you see something, even tho in fact, you did not. You will trully believe you saw it, but in fact, it was just your brain playing pranks on you.

It's similar to religious people who say the god talked to them directly. In some cases, I do believe they are not making it up, that they trully believe god speaks with them, yet it's not truth,it's just an illusion their brain is playing on them after so many year of ferocious faith and indoctrination.

For example, have you seen faithhealers? THAT is the power of suggestion. They make people believe in their bullshit SO much that they actually get a real stroke when the man touches them.

Raylightsa3 · « **Reply #36 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:32:28 AM »

Quote from: elvikun on March 30, 2012, 02:28:55 AM

Quote from: Raylightsa3 on March 30, 2012, 02:17:32 AM
My interpolation of what you said is our imagination taking physical form or projecting itself into a form of energy making these phenomena happen. but I could be wrong but this is how i perceive your power of suggestion
As in when enough people believe in god, god will come to be? No.
That is not what I meant.

What I meant is that you can make yourself (even not on puprpose) believe you see something, even tho in fact, you did not. You will trully believe you saw it, but in fact, it was just your brain playing pranks on you.

It's similar to religious people who say the god talked to them directly. In some cases, I do believe they are not making it up, that they trully believe god speaks with them, yet it's not truth,it's just an illusion their brain is playing on them after so many year of ferocious faith and indoctrination.

For example, have you seen faithhealers? THAT is the power of suggestion. They make people believe in their bullshit SO much that they actually get a real stroke when the man touches them.

yea I get ya but if its only an illusion it dosnt explain how things move themselfs even when others seen it besides me how can that just be power of suggestion cuz people see things all in different ways but if seeing the same thing by others it has to be more

megido-rev.M · « **Reply #37 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:44:15 AM »

Quote from: Raylightsa3 on March 30, 2012, 02:25:35 AM

if people think this way or that way thats fine with me just as long as they dont judge me or condemn me with it

Some people might simply not care whatsoever. lol

Quote from: elvikun on March 30, 2012, 02:28:55 AM

Quote from: Raylightsa3 on March 30, 2012, 02:17:32 AM
My interpolation of what you said is our imagination taking physical form or projecting itself into a form of energy making these phenomena happen. but I could be wrong but this is how i perceive your power of suggestion
As in when enough people believe in god, god will come to be? No.
That is not what I meant.

What I meant is that you can make yourself (even not on puprpose) believe you see something, even tho in fact, you did not. You will trully believe you saw it, but in fact, it was just your brain playing pranks on you.

It's similar to religious people who say the god talked to them directly. In some cases, I do believe they are not making it up, that they trully believe god speaks with them, yet it's not truth,it's just an illusion their brain is playing on them after so many year of ferocious faith and indoctrination.

For example, have you seen faithhealers? THAT is the power of suggestion. They make people believe in their bullshit SO much that they actually get a real stroke when the man touches them.

It is possible for people to convince or make sense of anything to themselves. In this case, it just takes lack of information plus limited scoping at but a single viewpoint, probably on top of memories whether twisted or not.

elvikun · « **Reply #38 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:47:54 AM »

@Ray
No, not really, again, look at religion - many people claim to see the same thing, altough it's very clear there was nothing.

In this case, you have told your friends what is going on before inviting them to see it, I presume. And they believed you and later on, saw exactly what you described. Or maybe they just said so.
I believe that if you want to go on and prove something, you have to start by eliminating rational explanations. For one, you'd have to get someone who knows nothing about the matter and without warning them they should look out for something make them witness the "ghost" the same way you did. They will not see anything, and if something, it would be very different from what you saw.

This works the same way as crowd panic and similar events. Once you tell people what should they look for, believers will see it all around. Weird example - If you say that the suspicious man with a brown coat and red bag is a suicide terrorist, you will suddenly find out that people see tenths of men with bombs everywhere.
Or the most fitting example, in art gallery, abstract paintings - Someone in the room says " That kind of looks like a house. " and suddenly, most of people who heard him will see a house in the painting, even tho before they saw nothing even remotely fitting a house.

As for moving objects, I would really make double-sure you are not a sleepwalker.

Raylightsa3 · « **Reply #39 on:** March 30, 2012, 02:52:48 AM »

well i get you there you got a point