Author Topic: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)  (Read 1056 times)

Offline nstgc

  • Member
  • Posts: 7758
    • http://www.justfuckinggoogleit.com
Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« on: May 21, 2012, 02:57:39 AM »
Right, so I purchased an F4 hoping I would get stock from before Samsung's HDD got taken over by Seagate. It has a tiny Seagate logo on the label along with a larger Samsung logo. It has a different serial number than my old Samsung (same size), but the same rev number. So, is it safe or should I take it back?

[edit] By the way, I haven't tried it out yet.

Offline datora

  • Member
  • Posts: 1411
  • "Warning! Otaku logic powers in use!"
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2012, 05:20:08 AM »
.
Don't know.

Looking at the newegg product page:

 - SAMSUNG EcoGreen F4 HD204UI 2TB 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5"

You can see the image is updated.  They are now manufactred by Seagate Technology LLC, made in China, and branded as a Seagate Barracuda Green drives.  Still has the SpinPoint logo on it, though ... which might be the important tell on the actual tech used.

Theoretically, since it was acquired by Seagate as a division, they should be using the same SpinPoint design.

But, I'm concerned about the manufacturing location.  The China drives for Samsung seemed to have a higher fail rate last year, and as we are all (for the most part) aware ... Seagate was completely ass drives for over two years.  The rep for China quality control/manufactured drives was in the toilet before all the flooding in Thailand last year.

One more nail for that coffin ... the warranty is now dropped to one year.  It used to be three.


Bottom line: I don't think they've been on the market long enough to know.  The positive is the Samsung technology that was rock solid.  The negatives are Seagate's ass reputation and decision to manufacture in China.

I'd have a hard time choosing right now, myself.  I want to see evaluations on these after they've been available for a year after these changes.  But then, with the consolidation of the HDD industry ... we really don't have choices anymore.  It's pretty much a Seagate or Western Digital world now.  Or, was it Hitachi bought Western Digital ..?  Can't remember anymore.
I win, once again, in my never-ending struggle against victory.

Offline Freedom Kira

  • Member
  • Posts: 4324
  • Rawr™.
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2012, 06:13:45 AM »
Nah, it was WD that bought Hitachi, if the acquisition was ever completed. Hitachi drives are still advertised as Hitachi though, and they still seem to be pushing new tech as if they were still independent. They pushed out 4TB disks fairly recently.

Offline vuzedome

  • Member
  • Posts: 6374
  • Reppuzan~!
  • Awards Winner of the BakaBT Mahjong tournament 2010
    • GoGreenToday
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2012, 07:17:49 AM »
Well just like any other hard drive, anything can fail at any time, regardless of the reputation.
BBT Ika Musume Fan Club Member #000044   
Misaka Mikoto Fan Club Member #000044
BBT Duke Nukem Fan Club Member #0000002

Offline xShadow

  • Member
  • Posts: 1503
  • No
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2012, 08:13:32 AM »
Well just like any other hard drive, anything can fail at any time, regardless of the reputation.

That's a moot point. The question is how likely it is to fail, not whether it can. I mean in theory, suddenly every country that had nukes could suddenly feel like shooting them all off and killing everyone.

What you're going for is a probability of failure equal to the above scenario (which is also hopefully low).




Anyhow: yeah, I noticed that Seagate acquired Samsung's HD division and I was not happy. I should have bought another one of these Spinpoint 2TB drives back when it was 80 bucks. The prices now are just fucking stupid, AND Samsung is now owned by pretty much the worst hard drive company in recent history.

I've got 3 samsung drives right now. All three of them have been performing beautifully for years.

Cute, huh?

Offline vuzedome

  • Member
  • Posts: 6374
  • Reppuzan~!
  • Awards Winner of the BakaBT Mahjong tournament 2010
    • GoGreenToday
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2012, 04:02:11 PM »
It's funny how I know a lot of people who trust Seagate more than Hitachi.
BBT Ika Musume Fan Club Member #000044   
Misaka Mikoto Fan Club Member #000044
BBT Duke Nukem Fan Club Member #0000002

Offline xShadow

  • Member
  • Posts: 1503
  • No
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2012, 08:33:48 PM »
It's funny how I know a lot of people who trust Seagate more than Hitachi.

Unless I missed some huge breakthrough that Seagate has made in recent times (plenty possible, I don't keep up with it):

They're all retards. And you can tell them that if you want.

Cute, huh?

Offline nstgc

  • Member
  • Posts: 7758
    • http://www.justfuckinggoogleit.com
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2012, 09:31:18 PM »
I use to swear by SG. I had problems with both WD and Hitachi, then I tried SG and they were great...until they started to such monkey balls like a boss. Maybe those people have some older drives from when SG knew how to make HDD instead of door stops?

Offline Freedom Kira

  • Member
  • Posts: 4324
  • Rawr™.
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2012, 05:58:13 AM »
Seagate's stuff used to be solid, back in the pre-TB HDDs. It was around when drives started to hit the 1TB mark that Seagate's reputation took a huge hit. A lot of Seagate's old <500GB drives are probably still alive and kicking today, but their drives from around that particular period were known to cause all kinds of problems.

I think WD and HItachi were more reverse, where their reputations now are better than they were before.

Offline nstgc

  • Member
  • Posts: 7758
    • http://www.justfuckinggoogleit.com
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2012, 01:58:25 PM »
I looked closer and it definitely was made in a SG factory. If I just run some tests on it would that compensate for their shitty QC? If so, what would you guys suggest?

Offline rostheferret

  • Member
  • Posts: 1584
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2012, 03:03:00 PM »
The oldest components in my PC are a pair of 160gig seagates, well over 6 years old now. I've had a Samsung and a Western Digital die on me in the mean time. I guess my real point is, it's all just dumb luck in the end.

Offline kitamesume

  • Member
  • Posts: 7221
  • Death is pleasure, Living is torment.
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2012, 03:10:13 PM »
my oldest drive would be a 12year old 80GB WD drive =p currently being used as a paper weight since its a 5400rpm drive that has no use as a storage device since it has such a tiny capacity while being bulky and all.

Haruhi Dance | EMO | OLD SETs | ^ I know how u feel | Click sig to Enlarge

Offline AnimeJanai

  • Member
  • Posts: 2474
  • http://anonym.to/?
    • Doujinshi Database & Lexicon
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #12 on: May 24, 2012, 07:15:35 PM »
Assuming that you haven't opened the sealed package, I don't know enough about whether or not your drive is from an older batch or newer batch.  But you do have a manufacture date, so if that is before the Seagate merger, then of course it is a Samsung drive.

Outside of the planned obsolescence built-in to each drive, I feel that individual drive failures are mostly due to the individual drive's characteristics.  If you don't know anything about the drive, then all you can do is lump all of these unknown characteristics into a vague term called "luck".   But, there are some empirical things you can do to pull factors out of this amorphous luck cloud.

First:  If the drive was sold as part of a low-priced "batch dump", then it may be statistically at risk.  So don't buy those if you have good rapport with the store manager and can get info on that.

Second:  It is my opinion that drives that vibrate a lot will have a greater chance of a head crash in its future.  While your drive is running, very lightly touch the side of the drive.  It should not be vibrating a lot if it has nicely balanced platters.  I touched a bunch of my drives out of curiousity and found that the older ones were "smoother" running than say the current 2TB ones (april 2012 manufacture date) from China.   It used to be that every new drive I purchased was always smooth and non-vibrating, but new drives from China always seem to have a slight vibration as compared to new drives from Malaysia or Thailand.  From experience, over time, some drives vibrate more as they age while other drives seem to not change at all.  As they have not failed before they were replaced, I have no experience as to whether or not the slightly vibrating drives were on their way to head crash failure from higher chances of rubbing on the platter due to the vibration.

Offline xShadow

  • Member
  • Posts: 1503
  • No
Re: Samsung F4 SpinMaster...[b]by Seagate[/b] (is it safe?)
« Reply #13 on: May 27, 2012, 06:36:25 AM »
my oldest drive would be a 12year old 80GB WD drive =p currently being used as a paper weight since its a 5400rpm drive that has no use as a storage device since it has such a tiny capacity while being bulky and all.

?

I'm still actually using an 80gb drive. It's not a lot, but if it works, it's not a big deal. Other than that, I have a 40gb (IIRC) in one of my computers (not in use). The smallest I've had was 8GB. I think we threw away that computer a good while ago though. It's not like I could have used that thing for anything more than like 2 anime seasons though.

I also still use a 16 MB flash drive.

Anyhow:

The oldest components in my PC are a pair of 160gig seagates, well over 6 years old now. I've had a Samsung and a Western Digital die on me in the mean time. I guess my real point is, it's all just dumb luck in the end.

To say it's all dumb luck is false. Just read this paper.

Summarized version (go to the comment with ~37 upvotes)

The only real beef I have with what he says in the summary is that the manufacturer doesn't matter. Although google didn't focus on it, quoting the study on page 4:

Failure rates are known to be highly correlated with drive models, manufacturers and vintages [18]. Our results do not contradict this fact. For example, Figure 2 changes significantly when we normalize failure rates per each drive model.

Combine this with the study talked about here. The study basically says that who you buy it from matters!. You buy shitty drives, you get a higher chance of failures across the board. It's that simple.

So how do you weed bad drives out? Newegg has a very useful thing, it's called reviews. What I do is I take the reviews and list them by lowest rating first, and then I see how long the drive lasted for them. If you just have that rough patch of 1 egg votes in the 3-6 month period, that's fine. But if you have a lot of them that are failing right around one year to two years, that tells you it's a shitty drive and you shouldn't buy it. That's not the only thing you should be looking out for, but it's probably a major one.

That's how I made up my mind when I purchased my 1.5TB and 2TB Samsung drives, and guess what? They're still working now, years later. Another important thing to note, though, is that I mostly use them for archiving anime and watching anime (and some occasional music). So, I generally don't play games on them. They're not under terribly heavy use (though I recently copied my entire anime and ga--... I mean stuff... collection over to my friend for him to watch, which was a pretty heavy process). Like the study says, how you plan to use the drives, and what conditions you use them under matters, too.

And no, I'm not going to say that some of it isn't just pure luck. These drives are mechanical, that's always a factor. But to say that who you choose to go with doesn't matter is just stupid. You do more research, you get a lower probability of failure. It's simple.

As for the original topic post, since there probably currently isn't enough information about manufacturing changes regarding the new Seagate/Samsung hybrid drives (thus a lack of reviews about the new drives, too), I would hold off on them. If you can find something reliable, at comparable price, and they'll let you take the drive back for a full refund... then do it. If not... well, you'll just have to either take the plunge or decide on an alternative.




... Okay now that took way too much research. I was just interested myself, so that's why I did it. >_>

Cute, huh?