Optical drives becoming obsolete?

[zzzYuyu]

I need a DVD drive to install chipset drivers after a fresh install of Windows. And nope, can't download the drivers because the LAN port won't work before you install the drivers from the DVD.

You could make a customized Windows installation DVD/USB/whatever with the drivers already added :]

Would still need a DVD drive to have the drivers at hand first (As well as the Windows installation files, I think?). Of course I could remove it afterwards if I were to store the installation on a USB device.

[lapa321]

Another thing. There was a topic here in bbt on how do you store your downloads. I was amazed that some people here use HDDs and not optical media. You can't do that now, the warranty period before was 5 years and now it's only 2 years plus HDDs today are getting inferior they break in a matter of time. Maybe it's easy to replace for a new one but the trouble is not worth.

I had atleast 20 pudding cases (50CD capacity), dumped them when i moved to DVD's

Currently have 32 pudding cases (50DVD capacity, usually filled with 52). That's about 6 terabytes worth of data. I made a program that catalogues every file, so you can ask for any obscure filename or anime series, and i'll have the physical DVD containing it in under 2 minutes. I did say that aside from my archives, i barely used the DVD drive. But 99.9% of my use *IS* accessing my archives Not reallysure if i should have emphasized that before since i'm not sure just how many people use their dvd drives for archiving.

Since last year tho, i've started moving to harddrives, a 2TB harddrive is equivalent to 8 pudding cases. That's a pretty big space saver. If it wasn't for the floods i had been planning on getting more 2TB's and moving the DVDs into them Unless the harddrive prices lower, i may end up going back to DVD's.

@zzzYuyu
Actually, i've done a lot of installations (especially when putting pc's together en masse for companies), and Win7 legacy drivers work fine. Atleast good enough to get the PC fully running and connecting to the internet to get the updates. With the LAN/Wifi up and running, i can simply copy additional installers and drivers off a main server if need be. The only critical thing is to get that network card running.

[zzzYuyu]

@zzzYuyu
Actually, i've done a lot of installations (especially when putting pc's together en masse for companies), and Win7 legacy drivers work fine. Atleast good enough to get the PC fully running and connecting to the internet to get the updates. With the LAN/Wifi up and running, i can simply copy additional installers and drivers off a main server if need be. The only critical thing is to get that network card running.

There are no real legacy drivers for my motherboard since the motherboard is 2 years newer than Windows 7 itself.

[vuzedome]

You don't call them legacy, they're generic.

[rostheferret]

Another thing. There was a topic here in bbt on how do you store your downloads. I was amazed that some people here use HDDs and not optical media. You can't do that now, the warranty period before was 5 years and now it's only 2 years plus HDDs today are getting inferior they break in a matter of time. Maybe it's easy to replace for a new one but the trouble is not worth.

I used DVDs once. About 3 years on half of them refuse to work and need replacing. I'll definitely take HDDs over Optical media, it's quicker and easier to backup, smaller (physically), easier to notice when they 'expire,' and honestly, £100 for a 2TB HDD isn't a huge amount for all that convenience.

[per]

Another thing. There was a topic here in bbt on how do you store your downloads. I was amazed that some people here use HDDs and not optical media. You can't do that now, the warranty period before was 5 years and now it's only 2 years plus HDDs today are getting inferior they break in a matter of time. Maybe it's easy to replace for a new one but the trouble is not worth.

I used DVDs once. About 3 years on half of them refuse to work and need replacing. I'll definitely take HDDs over Optical media, it's quicker and easier to backup, smaller (physically), easier to notice when they 'expire,' and honestly, £100 for a 2TB HDD isn't a huge amount for all that convenience.

HDD:s that are not actively used almost always last longer than normal quality DVD:s, yes, especially if the DVD:s are not keept in a cold, dark place for storage (such as a bank vault or similar).

And a DVD can barely hold any data at all, so having backups on optical media is really not very convenient. I would need some 3k DVD:s to backup my harddrives.

If nothing else that would cost about $3k with even semi-durable DVD:s ($30k with 'archival quality' discs, that are guaranteed to last 5 years when stored in a dark room temperature place).

It is almost always better to use live-storage, and copy from broken drives as needed.

However, always make sure to have at least two copies of the data (either use RAID/mirroring or simply have two copies).

If you really want to make sure it survives, also store the data off-site. That is sort of overkill for most downloaded stuff, though, since there is already an online backup..

[megido-rev.M]

Another thing. There was a topic here in bbt on how do you store your downloads. I was amazed that some people here use HDDs and not optical media. You can't do that now, the warranty period before was 5 years and now it's only 2 years plus HDDs today are getting inferior they break in a matter of time. Maybe it's easy to replace for a new one but the trouble is not worth.

A. warranty is irrelevant as you lose all data when it takes effect
B. avoid low grade hard disk drives
C. take care of the stuff, and do it well

Optical discs are read-only and slow, and can rot, not something would I like dealing with. Incidentally, I have old archive DVDs lying around which I'm pretty much going to dump out when I get to it. Not sure if me leaving them vulnerable to sunshine has been very helpful in preserving them either.

[1212magicman]

Discs get scratched and smudged, where as hard discs usually never fail completely before you can back up your data. I still have my old ones from 98 and they sure lasted longer than my CD's from the same era which are now cup coasters.

[GoGeTa006]

I thought the poll was gonna b pretty 1 sided but its a very fair match . . .specially between "Yes" and "My Little Pony Roxx my Soxx"

[Freedom Kira]

Another thing. There was a topic here in bbt on how do you store your downloads. I was amazed that some people here use HDDs and not optical media. You can't do that now, the warranty period before was 5 years and now it's only 2 years plus HDDs today are getting inferior they break in a matter of time. Maybe it's easy to replace for a new one but the trouble is not worth.

Warranty period is not a valid indicator of how reliable a disk is. While there is some correlation due to manufacturers choosing their warranty periods to cover a certain percentage of failures, it is not definitive.

Modern HDDs do suck compared to old ones, but the point of "they break in a matter of time" applies to every HDD ever manufactured. Every disk will fail given infinite time.

And despite all that, HDDs are still far more reliable and less expensive in the long run than optical media, not to mention much easier to use and less time-consuming. Optical media degrades over time - I'd be surprised if the DVDs sitting on your shelf haven't lost your data after 5-10 years. And like someone else mentioned, HDDs fail gradually, while optical discs are instant. You can usually get the majority of your data out of a failing drive before it completely crashes and burns, but once a sector or two of a DVD is gone, you're completely screwed.

While DVDs still offer the lowest potential $/GB (about $25 for 100 discs = about 440GB), it's difficult to go through a 100-disc spindle without a single coaster. And even after that, in the time it takes you to burn 20 DVDs, I can transfer enough data to fill a 1TB disk. It really isn't worth it.

[kamuixtv99]

I have tried it before, using hdd instead of optical disc. Doesn't work for me. That Seagate hdd was new I think it happened in 2009 it failed twice(replaced twice in a gap of 2 months). I lost all the files on it (lost all the files twice too), Of course it's not caused by a virus. It's a hardware problem. I tried to save my files but it's really freakin slow, so I had re-downloaded them again after I got a replacement. Since Sony closed down their optical disc factory I'll be using Taiyo Yuden, don't you trust this brand? Sure, I'll try another hdd again when 1TB (or bigger) here is lower than $50. A device that would be a 'throw-away' in 2 years is a big NO for me, with devices, it should last at least 5 or more (it's typical). We are talking about anime here? Yes it's ok for me if the recordable disc would be dead in 5 to 10 years time. Retail anime discs should last longer or forever. I have a collection of retail music discs bought 20 years ago and retail R1 DVDs (FY, kenshin, rayearth...what I care most is rayearth, the prices was like (crazy) BDs of today) bought 12 years ago they still work like a charm.

[rostheferret]

^That's why you use RAID And I think you had some bad luck, I'm using a couple of 6 year old seagates and a 2 year old 2TB Hitachi for storage still going strong. I really need to get a backup for my Hitachi though, been meaning to do it for years :/

[buchno]

Yeah, I've never lost a disk either, so you've been very unlucky.

Even so, I should be using RAID, but once bitten, twice shy is the saying, right?

[revo]

I use RAID 0 and it's super awesome
significantly better performance and I naver had problems with it (2x Samsung F3 500GB)

[rostheferret]

I use RAID 0 and it's super awesome
significantly better performance and I naver had problems with it (2x Samsung F3 500GB)

Errr... not if we're talking about BACKUP solutions...

[nstgc]

I use RAID 0 and it's super awesome
significantly better performance and I naver had problems with it (2x Samsung F3 500GB)

That almost doubles the chances of losing data, and when you do lose it, you lose it ALL. RAID 0 isn't really a proper RAID (Redundant Array of Inexpensive Disks). I use RAID 1 with 2 WD RE4s. It, however, only protects against drive failure. There are other problems that can happen, like file system corruption, and viruses.

[per]

That almost doubles the chances of losing data, and when you do lose it, you lose it ALL. RAID 0 isn't really a proper RAID (Redundant Array of Inexpensive Disks). I use RAID 1 with 2 WD RE4s. It, however, only protects against drive failure. There are other problems that can happen, like file system corruption, and viruses.

To protect against filesystem corruption use a filesystem with checksums (such as zfs), and to protect against viruses or accidental removal, use a filesystem with snapshots (say, zfs).

I automatically take a filesystem snapshot every few minutes, then keep one per hour for a week or so, then one per day for a few months, then one per week until I run out of disk space (all automatic).

So, if I accidentally remove a file it is very easy to restore it.

Also, redundancy is required if you actually want to keep your data, regardless of storage medium. RAID1, or, if you can live with slower storage but more space, RAID(5/z/z2).

[nstgc]

How's ZFS support through FUSE (in linux)?

[per]

How's ZFS support through FUSE (in linux)?

You are almost certainly better of using the native version from http://zfsonlinux.org/

[nstgc]

^ Oh wow, thanks.

On subject.

I almost exclusively use my BD burner for archiving. I have a handful of old games that I will occasionally install with it, and I do a clean reinstall of Windows every 6 months or so. Aside from that, I don't need an ODD, but I still wouldn't call it obsolete, because, as mentioned, too many companies (MPAA members and RIAA members) are stuck on physical media. The only legal way that I know of to obtain music in a lossless format is by ripping a CD yourself.