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Is Fanservice hate nonsense?
Nikkoru:
You can't slut shame a fictional character. I'm sorry, you can't.
There's a difference between a real person who owns their body and has free will and someone drawing or writing their own sexual fantasy. They do not get the same respect and in no way should.
Also, there's a difference between cheesecake and mature sexuality. The latter isn't gratuitous and doesn't detract from the narrative, or might be salient to its themes. For an example, Mamoru Oshii's Ghost in the Shell is a brilliant and milestone work in the artistic history of anime. It prominently features extended shots of its doll-like protagonist in the nude, twice. It isn't however, just mindless titillation that we're spending these long moments glancing voyueristically at the Major's physical form. There's a reason for those shots to be there, just as there are reasons for every single image in an Oshii production, and that's to express the complication of sexuality and the artificial nature of the protagonist. Oshii intentionally makes her non-sexual in voice, posture, attitude - in the same token she's deprived of most visible signs of humanity. We see her being built, literally, and that's something we are aware of until the conclusion, where she is, again literally, deconstructed.
Another example is Cowboy Bebop, which used overt sexuality. Usually in reference the American exploitation movies it was paying homage too. The hyper-sexualized female bodies depicted at times are juxtaposed against more realistic personalities and circumstances, the world of Bebop isn't just one thing and nor are its characters.
Even Elfin Lied, while being a miserable sack of nihilism, didn't violate the tone or substance of the show through its overt use of T&A.
My top ten.. hell, my top twenty anime have very little fanservice involved, there are very few anime labelled "ecchi" that I care about in the least.
Pentium100:
For some series the fanservice (and I am using this term to mean the ecchi fanservice) is OK, but I wish some other would not have it.
For example, take, say, Moetan - fanservice is OK there as the series do not really have an interesting plot. Same could be said about Strike Witches or Sky Girls.
On the other hand, I really wish the Nanoha movies did not have the extended transformation scenes - the movies are quite good action movies, but I know that some people would just latch on those scenes and not see the rest of the movie ("Well, we watched a movie where a 9 year old gets naked and then fights another 9 year old").
Also, Kodomo no Jikan has quite an interesting plot, but the fan service makes it so that the series cannot be shown on TV and may be illegal to posses in some countries.
My opinion about fanservice is that if you don't need it then don't add it, it will make bad anime a bit better (maybe worth watching just for the fanservice), but good anime worse. For example, I really don't think that upskirt shots would have improved Card Captor Sakura or Gosick.
--- Quote from: Zalis116 on August 25, 2013, 07:02:33 PM ---Or in other words, "I can't care about female characters unless they're figureless, sexless dialogue machines, just like my hero Ayn Rand." Just another one of those "everything must be completely innocent or hardcore pornography, no middle ground is allowed" types.
--- End quote ---
No, but I have a hard time taking a show seriously if its female characters are pretty much naked all the time or of the show spends more time showing the character's tits or ass (or panties) than showing her face. And even harder time showing it to others, especially if some of those characters are underage.
After all, you do not see a lot of "fanservice scenes" in live action movies. Yes, there are some, but not as much as in modern anime and all are legal.
Lord of Fire:
--- Quote from: Pentium100 on August 27, 2013, 03:28:14 AM ---Also, Kodomo no Jikan has quite an interesting plot, but the fan service makes it so that the series cannot be shown on TV and may be illegal to posses in some countries.
--- End quote ---
And yet, it serves a purpose, and arguably, an important one, at that. It's there to show us how these girls develop (sexually) over the course of (roughly) three years.
A lot of people have issues with this (probably because the very topic of a child being sexually active is one society frowns upon), but I can't really think of a better way to show how these girls deal with their desires than by having them do every 'dirty' trick in the book, from showing off their underwear to masturbating.
lololitas:
--- Quote from: Lord of Fire on August 27, 2013, 04:37:07 AM ---A lot of people have issues with this (probably because the very topic of a child being sexually active is one society frowns upon), but I can't really think of a better way to show how these girls deal with their desires than by having them do every 'dirty' trick in the book, from showing off their underwear to masturbating.
--- End quote ---
Not the case in germany, I remember seeing a mother at a local store discuss with the clerk which type of condom would be best for her 12 yo son. Considering that sex-ed starts in second grade (with a funny cartoon movie to boot) here, and that non explicit sexscenes are usually rated 12+ I don't think fan-service has anything to do with what series air here. An example would be serial experiments lain, where her scant dressing is to show her neglect of societal values and it's not used as an eyecatch. The series was viewable around noon on Animax (our only anime dedicated channel)
Anyway, I wouldn't put sexual themes on the same level as fanservice in general. There might be no visual difference, but the former actually has story impact while the other is just there to bind peoples' (arguably mens') eyes. I do hate it when a series that is not a comedy has totally out of place fanservice, however when you look at shinsekai yori (not really fanservice but more provoking themes) I think it belongs there for explaining certain concepts the series tries to show.
Edit: Both don't really fit the steroetype of fanservice, however I do know some people in jordan and the US whose parents were agitated by these scenes Oo
Pentium100:
--- Quote from: Lord of Fire on August 27, 2013, 04:37:07 AM ---And yet, it serves a purpose, and arguably, an important one, at that. It's there to show us how these girls develop (sexually) over the course of (roughly) three years.
A lot of people have issues with this (probably because the very topic of a child being sexually active is one society frowns upon), but I can't really think of a better way to show how these girls deal with their desires than by having them do every 'dirty' trick in the book, from showing off their underwear to masturbating.
--- End quote ---
However, it could have been implied without actually being shown. The same way in a live action movie they can imply that a character is naked without showing tits or ass, just by using various camera angles (example here - in most anime, you would get the full view even though the character would have "anime anatomy"). Same could be done here, the viewer did not need to see what the teacher saw to understand what he saw.
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