Video playback juddering on mpchc

[rustypwns]

Hi everyone. I checked if someone made a thread about this, but I never found one. I used to use VLC when I realized it was a bad player for anime, I then switched to cccp and then kawaii which I currently use. I have optimized all my settings and use madvr for "smooth frame" and I have a high end computer rig but I still get terrible juddering when a scene in an anime is panning, like the camera moves along the side

I heard it may be the TV, but I have used mine with 120hz, 60hz, you name it, it doesn't really fix the problem. I'm not sure if its that all .mkv encodes have this problem because my actual bluray discs played on my ps3 never have screen juddering.

Anyone know about this?

[rustypwns]

Sorry for double post but I found a solution, and I believe it's the only real solution given the circumstances that we have to download encodes which always diminish the quality of video playback.

So there's video player system called svp, smooth video project. It does exactly what I needed it to do. I removes all motion judder as if you're playing a movie straight from the source, it doesn't even depend on the screen you're using. I HIGHLY recommend this program because everyone is hung over kcp and the difference between kcp and cccp is almost unnoticeable. I'm so grateful for finding this and hopefully it gets more attention

http://www.svp-team.com/

[Krudda]

The 'juddering' you are seeing is present in the source material. It's a common problem with panning anime scenes.

[Gnabgib]

SVP isn't bad but it does take a decent amount of CPU horsepower.  It also introduces visual artifacts to do what it does unless you want to constantly tweak the settings.  You'll still get the artifacts in most cases anyway, they just won't be as glaring.  I eventually decided it wasn't worth the trouble.

Krudda is correct in that the judder is often in the source and it can't really be removed, although SVP will possibly make it less noticeable.  All that software like madvr's smooth motion or reclock will do is reduce/eliminate the judder introduced by the difference between the refresh rate and the frame rate.

[rustypwns]

I haven't tried reclock but madvr only slightly improved the juddering from the panning of shots. For me it was incredibly distracting to the point that I feel like rewatching certain shows just because of the fluidity of the animation now. It does put some stress on the cpu but if you have the hardware for it you might as well put it to use right? Thanks for the reply guys

Right now I'm using KCP plus ffdshow over lav filters (I believe if I set it up correctly) plus SVP and right now everything is running flawless. Installing the full SVP package messes up a lot of the neat settings kcp had set up so I learned how to combine the two, its easy

[Zalis116]

Sometimes it's not so much the source as it is the encode that creates the problem. If files are encoded with a frame rate that differs from the source's actual frame rate, there will be jerkiness in panning scenes, among other possible problems like ghosting.

[Krudda]

Out of curiosity, what were you watching?

A filename is preferred over series/episode name

[jagdtigger]

Right now I'm using KCP plus ffdshow over lav filters (I believe if I set it up correctly) plus SVP and right now everything is running flawless.

Are you shore the source is the problem? Play it under a live linux with VLC...

[Krudda]

Right now I'm using KCP plus ffdshow over lav filters (I believe if I set it up correctly) plus SVP and right now everything is running flawless.

Are you shore the source is the problem? Play it under a live linux with VLC...

I own a lot of blurays, not just stolen copies from the internet. I can guarantee, not always but quite commonly, even the blurays, playing in a sap, have jerky panning. DVD vs bluray here is a moot point btw, this is about framerate vs refresh rate.

[jagdtigger]

As far as i know the video players have built in Vsync, but of course you can try to force it in the windows display settings...

[Krudda]

But that doesn't help your point that the jerkiness isn't in the source, infact all that does is prove the source is the problem in the first place, at least, more than it proves otherwise.
Are you sure that's what you meant

[jagdtigger]

You have a point there. Now to think of it the source is the problem, or more accurately the quality vs size dilemma... But this line is off topic i think.

[Desbreko]

Judder is almost never a problem with the source unless maybe you're watching something that was mastered from film (screen shake) or the encode was poorly filtered (bad IVTC). Otherwise, it comes from your display's refresh rate not being an even multiple of the video's frame rate.

For example, if you watch a 30 fps video on a 60hz display (which almost all LCD computer monitors are), 60 / 30 = 2, so every frame is displayed for 2 screen refreshes and you get smooth motion with no judder. But most anime is 24 fps, so you get 60 / 24 = 2.5. And what happens when you switch frames mid-refresh? Massive screen tearing. Because screen tearing is ugly, you use vertical sync to force frames to only be drawn in sync with the screen refreshes. Thus, you get frames displayed in a 2-3-2-3 pattern of refreshes, which creates judder since the frames aren't all being displayed for the same amount of time.

The only way to get rid of judder without any side effects is to change the refresh rate of your display.

[Krudda]

Except anime is 23.976fps, not 24, not that it makes a massive difference.
I worded everything wrong in my replies, desbreko says what I meant to say.

[Desbreko]

Yes, but most displays are actually (or can also do) 59.94hz, so it doesn't matter. It's just easier to say 60, 30, 24, etc.